What do you think the last Lunar should be about?

[Alunissage]

Actually, I was thinking that earlier, that Hiro might hibernate with Lucia for another millennium or so. There really is no time context given.

I'm about certain you're wrong about the head not being targetable, seeing as the recommended strategy in the guide is to hit the head with everything and ignore the arms.

The Blue Star is to be revived by the accumulated power of the Silver Star, stored over the centuries. It's a minor plot point in the original game, and although that small scene was (disappointingly) removed, there's no reason to assume the developers changed their mind about it as the mechanism of the Blue Star's revival. Althena's power cannot be it, even joined with Lucia's, or they would have healed it rather than taking people to Lunar to begin with. However, there is precedent for Althena's power healing Lunar, both in the instance I mentioned in SSSC and, rather obviously, in the fact that she terraformed it to begin with. She did have help from the dragonmaster and the dragons, but repairing Zophar's damage is a much smaller scale.

Addendum: Preserving Alex alive is of course what I thought Luna should do, rather than choosing to die. EB was very annoying in that regard.

[Angelalex242]

That might be the recommended strategy after Lucia breaks free (When the head is indeed targetable) but it certainly isn't targetable till then. As I said, even Attack Alls like Catastrophe don't target it.

Also, if you take an insanely leveled up party in against Zophar, you can actually kill his first two hands so quickly that Lucia's speech about humanity is cut short and she breaks free early. I've done it before. The whole Ronfar/Lemina/Jean/Leo/Ruby/Hiro part of her speech just gets dropped. Besides, if it were possible for a level 99 party to target the head, it'd be possible to kill Zophar off before Lucia breaks free. And the developers wouldn't want THAT.

And I didn't say Lucia+Althena was it.

I said Lucia+Althena+Hiro would get fixing the earth done.

Althena didn't have (And didn't believe in) humanity when she left the Blue Star for Lunar in the first place. She figured out humanity several millenia later.

If Lucia's learned the lesson, however, she can draw on Hiro to do what Divine Power alone could not do.

While I think Hiro dying and Lucia going on alone makes for a better...if more tragic...story, the power of Althena should easily be enough to keep him alive. It's not like Lucia, immortal as she is, really NEEDS to hibernate. Or eat. Or sleep. Or anything else.

But, as you say, Zophar's damage is on a smaller scale. There's no reason for Lucia to release it when, perhaps, her natural power might be enough to fix it. Or at least augment Althena's power enough that it need not be released.

[Alunissage]

This is getting tedious. Your insistence on believing Lucia has power she's not proven to have makes you very repetitive.

Hiro is ONE human. Zophar was defeated by several. I don't think it's reasonable to assume the power of humanity in one human would be enough to revive things. If it were, then when Althena realized the power of humanity she could have used Dyne's and woken up Lucia and restored the Blue Star early. You keep trying to come up with some way that Hiro and Lucia do it on their own with Althena's power, but it just doesn't hold up. I know you have your own reasons, and perhaps in other contexts that would be fine, but here we usually care more about what works in the context of the games and the other materials than about making our favorite character be able to do things we want them to do. Wanting it doesn't make it so.

I'd forgotten that about the head, or was thinking of the later form. However, the point was that the hands have nothing to do with Althena's power or Lucia's or anyone's but Zophar's, and they don't support your theory at all.

[Angelalex242]

Actually, that's what I'm here arguing for. I know my own faults, and overpowering people is one of them. And there's game balance issues I'm taking into account behind the scenes.

However, my burden of proof isn't 'We all agree this is correct.' It's simply 'There's no evidence against it could've happened this way, and it's at least somewhat plausible it might've happened this way.'

Upon revising myself to meet that level of proof, I can take my theory, print it, and drop the subject.

So what I actually need you guys to do is less poking holes in it...rather, I need it revised to the level of proof I need. With the same general tone I originally had in mind.

And my own purposes sort of includes two necessary points.

First, that:
A:Lucia takes Althena's power when she leaves, so
B:Lunar is sustained by humanity's power alone.

Humanity has transcended the need for Divine Power by the end of Lunar 2, and the Silver Star being selfreliant is a point I need to make.

[Erasculio]

That might be the recommended strategy after Lucia breaks free (When the head is indeed targetable) but it certainly isn't targetable till then. As I said, even Attack Alls like Catastrophe don't target it.

Until, it is, Lucia breaks free. If you just defend the first rounds of battle, until she has finished speaking (and thus has broke through), you will fight Zophar with his four arms, while being able to hit his entire body.

Erasculio

[Alunissage]

However, my burden of proof isn't 'We all agree this is correct.' It's simply 'There's no evidence against it could've happened this way, and it's at least somewhat plausible it might've happened this way.'

Upon revising myself to meet that level of proof, I can take my theory, print it, and drop the subject.

So what I actually need you guys to do is less poking holes in it...rather, I need it revised to the level of proof I need. With the same general tone I originally had in mind.

Can't help you then, as I don't agree with your premises or think that they fit into the games well at all. (I don't like them personally either, but that's irrelevant.) I don't exactly feel a burden to help you reach a conclusion you've already decided on rather than working in the other direction. It's your job to work logically off of the material and see where you end up, not ours to help you validate what you want it to be. Besides which, I don't want people confused by your declarative "this is how it is" and thinking that you're saying stuff that's actually substantiated somewhere rather than you fantasizing, although I probably can't do much about that besides pointing out after every post of yours which stuff is and isn't substantiated. Which does get old.

We used to have a roleplaying board here, where this sort of thing would fit better. Not that speculation doesn't belong here, because of course it does, but you're not exactly speculating any longer.

[drumlord]

It would also be perfect for a "If I made Lunar, I would have..." thread.

[Angelalex242]

Bah. You have no idea how much it irks...or pains...me to toss away my theory in favor of rebuilding from scratch.

But, then, I suppose it's been done before. If Lunn can rework himself from scratch, I suppose I can do better then a video game character.

The Silver Star being a battery is a piece of information I didn't have while crafting the original theory.

So. Let's see. She leaves, and returns to the crystal, without Hiro originally. If she's surprised to see him later, he must not be ultimately neccesary to the revival of the planet.

I don't think the Crystal could be just a hibernation chamber. A goddess is immortal and doesn't need to eat, sleep (despite the bromide...), or even breathe unless she wants to.

So let's assume the crystal is something else again. If the Silver Star is a battery...let's say the Crystal is actually sort of a...charger. And a focus.

Assume further, then, that the Silver Star's energy is being transmitted to that crystal...and more accurately, to its occupant...to use for the Blue Star's revival. Lucia's dormant all those years because she's slowly, over the course of millenia, being honed into becoming a conduit for the massive power release using all the Silver Star's energy at once would be.

As pointed out elsewhere, Lucia normally is not capable of wielding such energy as Althena does, and the entire energy of the Silver Star has to be superior to Althena's total energy...as when Althena dies, her energy becomes simply part of the Silver Star, and therefore part of the battery.

So the crystal is actually reworking Lucia's physiology to be able to handle the power of revival...which is the power of the Silver Star entire...Althena's, humanity, the whole lot of it.

Lucia only awakens, then, because Zophar's threatening her battery, and hence, her job.

The Star Dragon, then, must understand that she has to be in solitude for some time longer before she can release the energy...hence, he doesn't want her to have visitors. Of course, he loses that fight, and he has to let Hiro go down anyway. He couldn't have predicted that Zophar's attack actually made the Silver Star...the battery...fully charged. The Power of Humanity was the last energy piece it needed to do its job.

Hiro, then, is irrelevant to the Blue Star's revival...he's just sorta there to be a boytoy.

The Blue Star revives because the battery, once fully charged, is simply used in a catacylsm of power, similar to but greater then Althena's Terraforming of Lunar in the first place.

Since the battery would have to be used completely...Lunar should then, in theory be destroyed...as the magic would've been sucked out of it, much like the Fortress of Althena did.

Since it's also a teleporter room, there's likely also a way to mass transit the people of Lunar back to the Blue Star to prevent them from being killed on the suddenly no atmosphere planet.

Would the recreation of the Blue Star, then, have any impact on Lucia herself? That's a hell of a lot of energy to channel. Far more then simply Althena's power.

[Alunissage]

Bah. You have no idea how much it irks...or pains...me to toss away my theory in favor of rebuilding from scratch.

Nice assumption there. Of course no one could possibly feel what you're feeling because, after all, you're feeling it. Not that I'm saying I have or haven't, just that it's yet another groundless assumption, although probably mainly a rhetorical statement. But many people have had to scrap work they put much time, effort, and thought into, not just you.

The Silver Star being a battery is a piece of information I didn't have while crafting the original theory.

I advise that if you're going to go to such efforts to make your theory airtight that you take the time to play the other games and give yourself as much information as possible. If the idea is to be plausible to people who are familiar with the games (since people who aren't won't know the difference), you should make sure you're familiar with them too.

I don't think the Crystal could be just a hibernation chamber. A goddess is immortal and doesn't need to eat, sleep (despite the bromide...), or even breathe unless she wants to.

Assumptions. Althena is clearly not a goddess in the omnipotent sense, and we don't know enough about the nature of her and of Lucia to decide what is and isn't necessary to their survival. I'm pretty sure more than once Lucia is said to sleep on the Blue Star.

So let's assume the crystal is something else again. If the Silver Star is a battery...let's say the Crystal is actually sort of a...charger. And a focus.

Nope. There's a second crystal in the Blue Spire into which she transports. I remember this well, because there was a typo in the EBC demo concerning its color which I emailed about and it was corrected in the final game. The place which collects the power is elsewhere, so the crystal on Lunar is likely only for transportation.

So the crystal is actually reworking Lucia's physiology to be able to handle the power of revival...which is the power of the Silver Star entire...Althena's, humanity, the whole lot of it.

This function doesn't exactly jive with her relationship with Hiro, then. You claimed that she was human enough to have a relationship with him, in an attempt to defend the ludicrous idea that Althena had a relationship wtih Dyne, and being a conductor seems incongruous with that. I won't descend to the level of speculating on intimate details, of course.

The Blue Star revives because the battery, once fully charged, is simply used in a catacylsm of power, similar to but greater then Althena's Terraforming of Lunar in the first place.

Greater than, not then. The latter is a measure of time, not a comparative.

Since it's also a teleporter room, there's likely also a way to mass transit the people of Lunar back to the Blue Star to prevent them from being killed on the suddenly no atmosphere planet.

This doesn't follow. The emigrants weren't mass-teleported to Lunar, according to the EBC/SSSC continuity. That's what Althena's Fortress is for, and likely why it was preserved intact in the Goddess Tower rather than falling into ruin with the other...ruins. It may have gotten damaged in the crash, or destroyed with Zophar; it's unlikely that there was an alternate method set up to get people back to the Blue Star. The Spire and the Star Dragon Tower are old -- they'd have to be, since Lucia wouldn't know about them if they were built after she went to sleep in the crystal -- and of course Althena didn't have the power to create an alternative after the fortress crashed if that did indeed destroy it. Although this is then a minor plothole in the games themselves, but SSSC is riddled with them anyway.

Therefore, a) the fortress was not destroyed enough for Luna/Althena to feel that its loss would make the plan of repopulating the Blue Star impossible or b) the fortress was created/built/powered by a means that did not require Althena, perhaps the dragons themselves. Either way, though (and of course they are not mutually exclusive), there is no basis to assume that the return would be mass teleportation when the journey was not. I think even in the SegaCD EB there are reliefs of ships going from the Blue Star to Lunar although the fortress is not, of course, in TSS.

Actually, I just took a look at the opening text of EB, which is in the screenshot section on the main site. It says that Althena took pity on the barren world and transformed it into "a place of beauty and wonder", naming it Lunar. However, time and circumstance soon forced Althena to populate it with people on the Blue Star. So in that continuity terraforming Lunar was not directly related to the destruction of the Blue Star; therefore, it seems unlikely that reviving the star would necessarily decimate Lunar. I'll have to read the beginning of Dragon Song when the English one is out to see whether that game specifies that she created the world (with the dragons, as the pic shows) because of the need to leave the Blue Star or prior to that need. Or ask Kizyr.

The last bit of text refers to a girl who could join the worlds or tear them apart forever. So that does support the idea that Lucia is key to the revival, although the exact mechanism is not elaborated on (that I recall). Time to start reading the EB text dump.

And yes, the opening shows a more literal depiction of Althena leading people to the Silver Star through space. Although it also shows the world being cratered, which doesn't match the text...unless it was the dark side that's depicted, of course.

Would the recreation of the Blue Star, then, have any impact on Lucia herself? That's a hell of a lot of energy to channel. Far more then simply Althena's power.

Checking the EBC screenshots, Lucia specifies that this place was made to focus the magic of LUNAR and channel it back to the Blue Star. A place, not a person.

By the way, have you considered the implications of Luna's message to Lucia? She knew Lucia would come. Does this mean that she foresaw Zophar's arrival? Or did she just know that Lucia would have to come to Lunar as part of her duty? I read the dialogue of that scene last night but I've already forgotten whether that point was covered.

[Angelalex242]

Yes, well. At least I'm making an EFFORT to think differently.

Playing the original games is not a possibility, however, as I simply don't own a SegaCD. The best I could do is hope somebody put a script on GameFAQs. So, barring reading the original scripts, the best I can do is play off you.

As for that...perhaps, but if they're the same type of being as Zophar, and Zophar need not even be corporeal to survive...well...

Then again, perhaps that's different. Considering the first thing the revived Zophar did is 'eat'...for lack of a better word...Althena's Fortress.

And Crystals for transportation...

Clearly, there's two...one in the Spire, one in the Star Dragon's tower. So there's likely two teleport points on the Blue Star.

But there's no grounds for or against the Crystal Lucia sleeps in to be the teleporter crystal. Indeed, that'd make little sense. Effectively like sleeping in one's car. No, she's probably sleeping in the battery Crystal on the Blue Star. Of course, there's no evidence either way for that.

I dropped my Althena/Dyne idea. I did say I was reworking from scratch. Not fair to hold me to something I dropped. Therefore, heck with Hiro's usefulness.

As for alternative methods...

There'd BETTER be one. Zophar ate Althena's fortress. Yummy. So it's completely irrelevant to my point whether or not Althena thought her fortress was still space capable. Or what Althena thought about her fortress at all. She evidently didn't count on Zophar having the whole thing for a snack. Zophar, however, must've known that was meant to be the transport, and it was simply another way to hurt Althena's memory to eat the thing. It didn't hurt he remembers well that the people escaped hi last time on that thing, and he didn't want them escaping that way twice. So I'm thinking his eating the thing was the final solution to Althena's Fortress. It's GONE, and it ain't ever coming back.

Presumably, then, there's either going to be very long lines at the spire or at the Star Dragon's tower for people to file off Lunar if Lucia can't do a mass transit with that stored power of the Silver Star. She's gotta evacuate a whole darn world, here. As it's a fairly safe assumption Lucia doesn't wanna kill anyone. Ya know, given how she balked at nuking Zophar for that very reason.

As for the Cratered world:All of Lunar looked like that before Althena did her thing. Like the Frontier. I believe Mia comments that without Althena's magic, the whole world will look as lifeless as the Fronteir. So. Based on that, Lucia draining the Silver Star's battery dry will indeed slay the Silver Star as a habitable location.

As for the last point...

It's more 'deific' if Althena does in fact predict Zophar's gonna come back. A little more on the omniscient side. Althena knows she didn't kill Zophar. She just booted him. She knew Zophar would eventually return. And that Lucia would be called on...not to deal with it, but to be shown that mortals could deal with it. Althena knew well Lucia had never learned the lessons she had. She hadn't BEEN around humans. To the point where human customs are alien to her. However, she didn't, apparently, predict Zophar'd eat her fortress. Oops.

But I don't think the point was truly covered, other then the fact old Luna goes on and on about, "Lucia, if you're here, you must've had the help of many good friends. Believe in them..." And so on. Of course, Lucia doesn't believe old Luna, but there ya go.

While true she mentions 'focus it back to the Blue Star' it's also true that power has to be controlled. That's why Althena/Luna originally refuses to leave with DM Alex out of Althena's tower. "The power would flow too rapidly..." or something like that. Of course, she doesn't have the power to control it alone, but Alex's power in combination with hers gets it done.

The Silver Star has significantly more power, again, then simply Althena's...and nobody else is left alive to channel that much power save Lucia herself. ...however, Hiro is no Dragonmaster, and has no power to give up, so I don't think he can actually pull an Alex and help her. Lucia's literally on her own channeling the power. However long it'd take to do that...Which is likely a lot longer then Althena/Luna believed she'd be stuck in the Goddess tower taking care of her own power.

[Alunissage]

YesPlaying the original games is not a possibility, however, as I simply don't own a SegaCD. The best I could do is hope somebody put a script on GameFAQs. So, barring reading the original scripts, the best I can do is play off you.

Don't bother with GameFAQs for that, go here. And, of course, I again refer you to the screenshot sections on the site. There should be a video of TSS available eventually too...but text won't play much of a role in it.

Clearly, there's two...one in the Spire, one in the Star Dragon's tower. So there's likely two teleport points on the Blue Star.

That's not what I was referring to. By that count there's at least three. I had a discussion a long time ago about whether the Star Dragon Tower also pointed to Lucia's Tower or to some other point on the Blue Star, forcing Hiro to hike over to it. I don't remember which side I was arguing on, though, if there was one. In retrospect, though, you may be right that the crystal she's sleeping in is not where she departed from since if Hiro did get beamed to the same location then it would have become rather crowded. However, I'm pretty sure that she does in fact take off from her tower. Teleportation probably isn't strictly accurate, since a beam of light departs and a beam of light arrives and the implication is that it was a more or less straight trip.

I dropped my Althena/Dyne idea. I did say I was reworking from scratch. Not fair to hold me to something I dropped. Therefore, heck with Hiro's usefulness.

Yes, that was commendable and made discussion easier, or perhaps simply possible. That's not what I was getting at, though. I was saying that being a channel for power might render Lucia sufficiently unhuman to be incapable of a human relationship.

Re getting to the Blue Star, the likely in-game solution is to find yet another hitherto unknown ruins, should there ever be a game depicting these events. Actually, that sort of makes sense. Dragon eye jewels are found in/used for several towers: the Blue Spire, the Star Dragon Tower, the Sunken Tower/Water Shrine (whatever it's called), and the Dragon Ruins. We still don't know where the eye Gwyn had came from; we just know there were two in the Dragon Ruins and one in the sunken tower which no one could see previously (in EB) or was underwater (in EBC). Why are they the dragon ruins? I'd hazard a guess that the dragons would play some role in the return simply because they clearly have their own power independent of Lunar's and Althena's. They didn't wink out of existence when she did. Anyway, I don't buy the idea that because one mode of return (which didn't exist in the original games) was wiped out the only alternative is Lucia becoming a Keeper (possibly obscure SF/fantasy ref).

Being more 'deific' is exactly why I don't like those predictions. It's pretty clear that Althena is not comparable to the idea of the Christian God, for example. She's not omniscient. She's not omnipotent -- indeed, her power's limits are a major story point. She's probably closer to the very fallible Greek god idea, just someone who's mainly a person with extra powers. As you point out, though, it doesn't really take omniscience or extra power to know that Zophar will return; it just takes common sense. Presumably Nall wouldn't have shown her the recording if he hadn't by the time the repopulation was due. (I'm reminded of the Foundation trilogy here...)

The Silver Star has significantly more power, again, then simply Althena's...and nobody else is left alive to channel that much power save Lucia herself. ...however, Hiro is no Dragonmaster, and has no power to give up, so I don't think he can actually pull an Alex and help her. Lucia's literally on her own channeling the power. However long it'd take to do that...Which is likely a lot longer then Althena/Luna believed she'd be stuck in the Goddess tower taking care of her own power.

More THAN. Come on, I know you can grasp this.

Anyway, I don't think it'd be a good idea to discount the dragons again. In that vein, recall when the party first gets to the Goddess Tower in Pentagulia and are menaced by Zophar's minions....Althena's theme plays and the are transported out of danger, to Nall's room. So. Either Althena was alive still in some form (which I'd personally like but don't think would fit so that's pretty much out) or someone else was using her power -- and it's to Nall that they go, and Nall's dragon equipment that gets people out of danger. The association of the dragons with both Althena and terraforming is so obvious I feel silly for mentioning it. Add to that that the Star Dragon is guardian of the second known mode of transport (and an intact one at that, unlike the ruins the other eyes are in) and there seems a reasonable association of the dragons with both travel and revival.

And, of course, it's unproven that anyone alive need attend to the power at all. Althena clearly didn't worry about it, and she only anticipated Lucia arriving in the event that Zophar revived. Had he not, Lucia may well not have woken until people were arriving. On the other hand, we don't know for sure that she only recorded one message.

Lastly, if the device accumulating the power was destroyed, as EBC implies, would it be necessary to start over? Another few millennia? In EB the device isn't destroyed, as it's located in the Blue Spire, but the implication is that Lucia uses it up to help Hiro and therefore sets back the Blue Star's revival by rather a lot. Either way, there seems to be a problem.

[localflick]

I'm sorry, I don't want to interrupt this, but that the script dump site is very cool, and Alunissage, I was wondering if you knew of any Konami translation sites.

I really like Silent Hill Play Novel, and while I understand what's going on I'd like to actually know the text. There's a half-translated interactive version at Silent Hill heaven, but since it's so text-heavy a translated script is really hard to find.

[Alunissage]

I don't, but I strongly recommend that you email the person who runs that site, Artemio Urbina, and ask him. I don't think I've ever played any Konami games myself, to be honest.

The story of how I learned of that site is rather funny. I got in a minor bidding war for Japanese EB (which at the time was going for rather a lot, making it one of my most expensive games) right as the auction was ending, and just barely got it, beating him by a couple bucks. He emailed me through eBay to say "well fought" and mentioned that it would've been the last he needed for his Lunar collection. I replied mentioning that it was about the last I needed (by my definition at the time, I suppose, since I've gotten several since then) and we talked for a bit about collecting and he pointed me to his site. I was slightly surprised (which in retrospect seems rather silly) to see him on these forums some months or so later. He's re-regged here as Snatcher but hasn't been around in a while.

[GhaleonOne]

More THAN. Come on, I know you can grasp this.

It's just a word... I understand the need to try and get people to use correct grammar, but some people have trouble with certain grammar aspects and spelling. I've always had trouble with certain words, and reminding someone of the mistake over and over doesn't help as much as it might seem. (in fact, it can make a new person to a forum feel fairly unwelcome) It's not like his grammar and spelling are horrible. And nowhere near some of the younger members that have come in that don't even know what punctuation is. It's one pretty minor grammar error in quite a lengthy post. Pointing it out like that is a bit harsh IMO.

[Angelalex242]

Right. At any rate, I want to say that Lucia's sleeping crystal is actually the main battery for the Blue Star's revival...and she sleeps in it to try to flow with the power so she can do her job.

Anyways, Lucia's fortress was fairly big. There could've been a teleporter room...or even two seperate teleporter rooms, one of which connected to the Star Dragon, and one of which connected to the Blue Spire. At that point, the beam could appear to be going to roughly the same place, when one considers intergalactic flight...when in fact, it's two completely seperate rooms.

Also, being a channel did render Lucia too inhuman to have a human relationship. She wasn't anything remotely resembling human when she arrived. Thankfully, however, she was a bright young goddess and picked up human ideas fairly quickly.

The Dragons might well be responsible for helping with both Terraforming and Transport. The 4 doing the former, and the Star Dragon handling the latter. "Okay, people, everyone this way...that's right, step on the portal, we're all going to Lucia's place..." Then again, the Blue Star IS still much bigger then the Silver Star, and they had guidance with the Silver Star, so Lucia certainly isn't going to be sitting out. She's just going to have some very welcome help.

Also, again, the battery of power that had been accumulated was being transfered to Lucia's sleeping Crystal on the Blue Star for eventual release. If she had to start over, there certainly wouldn't be green on the ground in Hiro's lifetime...let alone while Hiro's still young, no less. Thus, regardless of where the power 'jumper cable' is on Lunar, the power must actually be being stored on the Blue Star itself.

Fixing Hiro, then, in EB (Which I haven't played, mind, only heard about second hand) was rather like touching the jumper cable, rather then taking anything out of the battery. The battery isn't on the Silver Star at all. She just tapped into the grid to borrow a little extra firepower. And in EBC, Hiro never got taken out, so.

Althena wouldn't worry about it cause she knew her backup was still there on the Blue Star to handle the power. So she...kinda selfishly, perhaps, from Lucia's point of view...kicked the bucket and dumped it all on her.

I idly wonder who's running the afterlife if the goddess everyone expects to see on dying is there as a mere dead mortal...but, sidetrack.

Anyways, if the battery's Lucia's Crystal, and the Silver Star is forwarding the energy to the Blue Star as soon as it gets it, it'd explain why the loss of the jumper cable wouldn't actually slow the revival down. Apparently, Lucia awakens within about a year of when she would've awoken anyway to do her thing. Either that, or a bunch of lazy animators forgot to age Hiro.

Or, possibly, that's a Ghaleon style Zombie Hiro when the Blue Star Revives if it takes milennia on milennia to do. Though I really can't see a goddess of life and creation and love and beauty and everything else Lucia swiped from Althena (never mind what she started with) making somebody undead. Yet, if she's weaker then Althena and didn't keep the power of Althena, there's no reason to assume she can make Hiro immortal anyway.

So the next thing is, the revival must've happened on the Blue Star before Hiro noticeably ages. That means, she has less then...5 years, tops, to pull the trick. So the battery couldn't have been drained, and it likely has to be forwarded to the Blue Star instead of actually being stored on Lunar.

[phyco126]

Eh, I still have issues with grammer. Not that I don't know, more that I don't notice until I already post, then I become to lazy to fix it (unless it's so horrible that people make mistakes in what I said, then I fix it if I see it.)

Spelling, grammer, I have my issues. Everyone does. The only time I really make an effort to correct it is if it's something like what I said in the above, a story that I'm writing, or something for school/work (neither of which I am doing so that is out.)

[Alunissage]

You mistake my intent, G1. It's because his writing is otherwise quite competent that I'm pointing out this one flaw. I don't single out other newbies for individual things like that in general, and even the general comments about language usually come from someone other than me (because I know that if I'm the one saying it it's more likely to get read as being unnecessarily picky and nasty than the person really needing to make the effort to be readable), and when I do comment unsolicited, as opposed to when someone expresses uncertainty about spelling a specific word, it's usually generalized. But errors can be a lot more noticeable when they're not surrounded by other errors. This person uses English well, and so it's a real jolt to see this glaring mistake, when in someone who is making lots and lots of mistakes it gets almost ignored other than incrementing the value of my bitter frustration at the abuse of our language and particular modern misconceptions (like spelling "populace" with -ous, or "caliber" with a u, or "per se" as persay, let alone "could of" and "here, here" and other errors which probably come from education not keeping apace with verbal vocabulary). I threw it in at first almost as a joke because I was quoting so much else and I thought it might be an innocent error, but since he repeated it I need to tell him that his otherwise decent impression of competence is being marred by it. I mean, if you're 98% there, why cling to that last 2%?

Back to the actual topic, I think the only thing I have offhand is that I don't recall Hiro and Lucia actually seeing the Blue Star become green. I recall the two of them standing with Lucia wrapped in Hiro's cape (apparently her powers of clothing don't extend to her own domain) looking out at something, but we don't see their surroundings...and then at the end we see the blue planet turn green, but we don't know if that's a depiction of happening right then, five years from then, or five centuries from then. I just checked and yeah, the clouds have parted...so? The ground's still awfully snowy. The Blue Star isn't shown as being a solid white disc in the games (for example, during Luna's song); the clouds aren't all-enveloping and sun must shine occasionally. They're just out on one of the good moments. In fact, the slow motion of Lunar around the planet during the credits suggests that a lot of time is passing. Perhaps that's the beginning of the calm, but it isn't the end. If you do think that it's the beginning of the revival, then the clear implication is that Hiro's presence is related rather than all this happening just before it was supposed to happen anyway. Either it took a long time or it happened because he was there...I don't think the timing was just coincidence.

Incidentally, when you look at that last screen, with the Blue Star looking alive again, the Silver Star looks much the same, even the side facing the viewer (and thus away from the planet). Doesn't look like it reverted back to being a pitted moon surface to me.

P.S. Phyco, I understand your reasoning, but if you even remotely care about what other people think of you you should make an effort anyway. Being lazy because you're not being graded will a) make you seem less intelligent, because like it or not people DO evaluate others on their words (and there isn't much else to evaluate online) and b) form bad habits which may stick when you don't want them to, e.g., when it actually is important. Mostly you do pretty well. I don't think you're a dummy, if you were wondering. But it does tend to suggest youth and perhaps not the best education. Not that highly educated people never make mistakes -- part of my job is to catch, point out, and fix my boss's errors (yes, he specifically has me correct him, and he's a tenured professor with a vocabulary bigger than mine) -- but the implication in errors coupled with very casual speech is that one's teachers didn't have quite the right effect on one.

[phyco126]

Well, with the topic at hand, if you recall from SSSC, the Blue Star never looked white, it still looked like, errr, Earth (though I'm not going to get into that arguement, at least not tonight, I'm just using that to compare looks)

Now, as for grammer and stuff, I understand completely what you mean. I'm quick to judge on how someone types. For instance, I meet someone on an online game who talked "hey u want to go kil things for lot of fun?" Complete with bad grammer and misspellings. I immediately labeled the guy as no older than 16, more likely alot younger than that. Only to find out, of course, the guy ends up being several years older than I am

Now, don't get me wrong, when I say I don't care and am too lazy, I still take pride in doing things right the first time. I really hate "u" and "r" used all the time. I rarely use those terms unless I'm in a quick hurry in a chat room, or IMing someone. I'm just too lazy to look over what I post, change any mistakes, etc... Now if I do catch it before I post it. Say, I spelt there, their, instead of, err, there, and I catch it out of the corner of my eye, then I will fix it, but I often won't edit a post unless it warrents it. An example would be the topic I made "Althena's Rebirths" I had spelt her name "Alethana's." As soon as I saw that, I immediatly went and edited the title.

Now, if the board had a spell check feature, then I would certainly use it As it is, I'm just too lazy to open a program, copy and paste, then make changes, then re-copy and paste... etc etc etc.

And I'm taking "Mostly you do pretty well." as a hell of a compliment I like my vocabulary, and I can spell fairly well, just sometimes I have my days, which never go well with my laziness

Oh, and for the record, I pretty much could care less anymore about how people think of me. I didn't always be that way, and I still try to impress some people, but over all, I've given up on caring. (Personal, long story reasons which I'm certainly not going to go into.) Now, take for example it's you, or G1, or Kizyr, or someone that I highely respect or know real well, then I tend to make more of an effort to care more usual

[Alunissage]

Aw, you took that better than I thought you would.

I know what you mean. I used to stress a lot more about my writing style online. I literally spent five hours on one post at the WDMB. To an extent I still do that, particularly if I'm saying something that I know might get a heated response or is voicing a very unpopular opinion on something people get intense about. As I mentioned another time, I do reread such posts before submitting and decide not to post about half of them, because expressing myself isn't always worth the possible negative feedback (and when I do post something that might incite such a response I often feel nervous and even ill the next time I view that thread, wondering what the response will be). However, when I'm writing email or typing on IM I'm no longer generally rushing to retype or correct an error I made...I know the people I'm talking to know me well enough to know that I'm making a typo and not showing that I don't know how to spell. (I don't claim great digital coordination; rather the reverse, really.)

I'm more sympathetic to the there/their/they're problem now than I was before using IM, too, because I found that as I continued to use IM and my typing skills and speed improved as a consequence that my fingers were very much taking the place of my mouth as far as my brain was concerned...and when I say a word I'm usually not mentally spelling it, I'm just producing the right sound to go with the concept I have in mind. The problem is, there are multiple spellings for similar sounds and sometimes when I'm not paying attention I'll type the wrong one. My usual example of this is when I saw myself type "dozen" when I meant "doesn't"...two words which are conceptually very remote and aren't even spelled similarly. That was a bit of an epiphany concerning the natures of errors of that sort and that if even I can make them then other people who make them may not be doing so out of ignorance or stupidity. It was probably good for me to learn that lesson. I'd already realized that the to/too/two error is understandable physically, since one might not hit the O the correct number of times or the W strongly enough (it's usually typed with the weakest finger), but I hadn't realized that it could also be a mental thing...an interesting side effect of improving the brain/fingers verbal interface to the point where the brain was treating it as spoken. You don't really spellcheck when talking, generally.

[phyco126]

Aw, you took that better than I thought you would.

That's because I knew what you meant when you responded

As for your last paragragh, I encounter that alot when typing. Even when writing stories, I often find myself using the wrong words. Their/there/they're, we're/where/were, etc... I often do what you mentioned. (And not to mention explained quite nicely I never thought of brain/fingers version of the hand/eye effect.