Pier Solar HD

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Leo
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Re: Pier Solar HD

Postby Leo » Sat Mar 14, 2015 8:12 pm

LunarRaptor wrote:I just told you that there are hundreds, if not thousands or even millions of homebrew games for these old systems. This is nothing special and most of these homebrews suck. Going through the trouble of either financially securing a working Megadrive or tracking one down is more than Pier Solar is worth. That is just wasted funds that could be used to feed your family.

I would just take my loss... if this game wasn't taking attention away from far, far better indie games. Eternal Daughter deserve this kind of attention. Guardian of Paradise deserves it. the white chamber (yes, all in lower case. That's just how the title is written) deserves an HD remaster and to be ported onto modern systems. 7Days, Alice Mare, Dreaming Mary, Eternally Us, Ib, Lisa: The First, Lisa: the Painful RPG, Mad Father, The Mirror Lied, The Longing Ribbon, the One Night trilogy, The Witch's House, Paranoiac, The Crooked Man, Mermaid Swamp, The Sandman, Wraith, Sainth, Middens, Which, OFF, Among the Sleep, Anna, Action 52 Owns (in which someone went through that mess game-by-game and fixed them all), the Deep Sleep trilogy, Master Reboot, the Ghost Suburb series, The Cat Lady Lifeless Planet, Claire, Year Walk, The Vanishing of Ethan Carter, DreadOut, certain titles among the various Yume Nikki games, Kraven Manor, The Desolute Hospital, Knock Knock, Limbo, Lone Survivor, Neverending Nightmares, One Late Night, Outlast (and its DLC Whistleblower), and From Dust are all infinitely better indie games than Pier Solar.
Hell, I'd say that even Yahtzee's Chzo series is more deserving. Five Nights at Freddy's even (oh yeah, I went there! What?), too. Hell, there are even several Amnesia: The Dark Descent Custom Stories that were better than this. I even derived more joy from "I Wanna Be the Guy" and its Gaiden.

For over fifty bucks in this economy, it had BETTER be as good as two of the BEST Final Fantasy games!


Well you threw out an extensive list of indie games you consider more deserving of the attention. Are they for console games and to be played on emulators? If so, which ones? Are most to all of them PC games?

Pier Solar got all of that attention because of the platforms it was on. It's been released on a ridiculous amount of them, too. You can definitely compare it to FF4 in that regard. :lol:

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Re: Pier Solar HD

Postby LunarRaptor » Sat Mar 14, 2015 8:42 pm

They're indie games. Exactly how many of them are going to be consoles, honestly? They're all PC games. A small handful might be available for consoles as well, but these are all meant to be played on the screen-and-keyboard devices we're conversing through.

Final Fantasy IV got all that attention because it was a genuinely good game back in a time where only the strong survived in the market. These days, you can slap anything together and call it a game and it'll probably sell. There is no better proof of that than Pier Solar.
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Re: Pier Solar HD

Postby Arm » Sat Mar 14, 2015 8:56 pm

I accept criticism when it's not mixed with provocative words. It's not very important anyway.

About the 8 bits story for the super nes, it was a joke by Fonzie, the game main creator. He's a sega fanboy so he wanted to put that.
I'm not the decision maker for this kind of things.
I know the super famicom is a 16 bits console and we are currently making a brand new action adventure game in the vein of pocky and rocky for it (as well as a beatemup like final fight for the Megadrive)

What you don't seem to understand is that programming a game on a system which is more than 20 years old in C language or assembler as well as creating specific tools and game engines from scratch has nothing to do with rpg maker which is a tool that anyone can use on powerful pcs to create games. Its much more complicated/restrictive because there is very little ram available. Moreover there isnt any support from Sega as it was the case back then.

The same can be said about all the new retro indie games, that make the games look like 16 bits but actually don't have any of the limitations of the 16 bits hardware and color palettes and tiles.

In terms of programming , pier solar made something no one else had done before: put to use a disc and and a cart at the same time on the megadrive/scd.

Almost anyone who bought it on the MD loved the game. There is a lot of people from sega16 who made positive reviews/comments.

There is a lot of people who liked the game and other people who didnt like it like for any game. I think the game deserved the attention it got (although it's still not enough imo) after all the efforts made to create the game. Even if it is not perfect, it has the merit to exist.

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Re: Pier Solar HD

Postby LunarRaptor » Sat Mar 14, 2015 9:39 pm

About the 8 bits story for the super nes, it was a joke by Fonzie, the game main creator. He's a sega fanboy so he wanted to put that.
I'm not the decision maker for this kind of things.

Yeah, I don't buy that it was just a joke. Not for a single solitary second. More like a Take That against the winner of the console war.

I know the super famicom is a 16 bits console and we are currently making a brand new action adventure game in the vein of pocky and rocky for it (as well as a beatemup like final fight for the Megadrive)

And I'm sure it will have lots in intentionally placed slow down time to make the SNes look bad.

What you don't seem to understand is that programming a game on a system which is more than 20 years old in C language as well as creating specific tools and game engines from scratch has nothing to do with rpg maker which is a tool that anyone can use on powerful pcs to create games. Its much more complicated/restrictive because there is very little ram available. Moreover there isnt any support from Sega as it was the case back then.

Oh, so you think you're better than all the indie developers I just listed just because they used different tools than you and didn't self-impose technical limitations on themselves?
What you don't seem to understand is that these people, like any other indie creator, had to use whatever tools they had at their disposal to make games. They didn't cheat or have it easier than Watermelon at all like you seem to be implying. For one thing, in most of these cases, their games are completely free and easy to download. These people don't expect their demographic to dig out their life savings or jump though hoops for them to play their games. They worked hard to make their games, often with just by their lonesome. Pier Solar has a team behind it. Don't act like these other developers are inferior to your pals at Watermelon in any way, shape, or form.

You can talk on and on about how the game was made from scratch and it means exactly nothing. It doesn't matter what tools people use to make games. The only thing that has ever mattered is the end result. The end results of the games I mentioned are far superior to Pier Solar. They're better written, better programmed, better paced, better on the eyes, and a lot more wieldy. Best of all, I don't have to dedicate roughly the same amount of time it took Frodo to walk to Mount Doom to complete any of the games I brought up.

Besides which, not even half of these games are RPG Maker. A lot of these ARE made from scratch.
To answer one of your points: yes, anyone can make a game in RPG Maker. How many have actually made GOOD RPG Maker games, though? A good game is a good game and it requires a lot of the developers behind them. Period.

The same can be said about all the new retro indie games, that make the games look like 16 bits but actually don't have any of the limitations of the 16 bits hardware and color palettes and tiles.

Shovel Knight is an unequivalently better game than Pier Solar and it has nothing to do with the hardware and everything to do with the talent behind it.

In terms of programming , pier solar made something no one else had done before: put to use a disc and and a cart at the same time on the megadrive/scd.

Big frikkin' whoop.

Almost anyone who bought it on the MD loved the game. There is a lot of people from sega16 who made positive reviews/comments.

Only because the developers deleted most of the negative reviews.

There is a lot of people who liked the game and other people who didnt like it like for any game. I think the game deserved the attention it got (although it's still not enough imo) after all the efforts made to create the game. Even if it is not perfect, it has the merit to exist.

That is a terribly arrogant thing to say. At least I'm recommending games I didn't have a hand in. Have you even played a single one of the games I brought up?
I never said it shouldn't exist. I said it doesn't deserve all the attention.
"All you have to do is decide what to do with the time that is given to you." -Gandalf the Gray

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Re: Pier Solar HD

Postby Alunissage » Sat Mar 14, 2015 10:01 pm

"It has the merit to exist" is terribly arrogant?

LunarRaptor, I think you need to step away from this thread. Permanently.

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Re: Pier Solar HD

Postby LunarRaptor » Sat Mar 14, 2015 10:22 pm

I will once Arm has taken back his thinly veiled claim that Watermelon is is SO much better than all the indie developers that made the games I listed because of the antiquated hardware they chose to work with.
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Re: Pier Solar HD

Postby Alunissage » Sat Mar 14, 2015 10:34 pm

No, he doesn't have to take back something he didn't say. You need to stop putting words in his mouth, stop calling your opinions objective, and stop drawing pointless false equivalencies, and it seems the only way you'll do all that is to stop talking. Your opinion was more than clear two pages ago and you're not adding anything further to this conversation.

Edit: Arm, I deleted your post because I want this personal stuff to stop, not escalate.

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Re: Pier Solar HD

Postby LunarRaptor » Sat Mar 14, 2015 10:35 pm

LunarRaptor, the correct response to being told to stop posting in this thread is silence.
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Re: Pier Solar HD

Postby Arm » Sat Mar 14, 2015 10:41 pm

No problem Alunissage.:) I already said what was needed when it comes to game info and responded correctly to all the hate despite what some people are insinuating. The rest is pointless. You can lock the topic if you want.:)

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Re: Pier Solar HD

Postby Alunissage » Sat Mar 14, 2015 10:59 pm

I don't really want to lock the topic, since I think Pier Solar is a perfectly reasonable thing to discuss and I want to have a place to make further comments when my husband and I get back to playing it. :)

A thread about indie games in general would be fine by me, btw. This just isn't that thread.

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Re: Pier Solar HD

Postby Leo » Mon Mar 16, 2015 4:23 pm

LunarRaptor wrote:They're indie games. Exactly how many of them are going to be consoles, honestly? They're all PC games. A small handful might be available for consoles as well, but these are all meant to be played on the screen-and-keyboard devices we're conversing through.

Final Fantasy IV got all that attention because it was a genuinely good game back in a time where only the strong survived in the market. These days, you can slap anything together and call it a game and it'll probably sell. There is no better proof of that than Pier Solar.


From what I can tell, most console gamers don't play PC titles enough to be aware of the ones that aren't unavoidable. Even if they are better than Pier Solar, it's understandable that they've gotten little attention.

What I meant was you can compare Pier Solar to Final Fantasy 4 because both can be played on a ridiculous number of systems. If I was to somehow implant a touch screen into my genitals, FF4 would likely be ported to it within 6 months.

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Re: Pier Solar HD

Postby Arm » Thu Nov 05, 2015 10:43 pm

For those interested, here are the 1st images of the dreamcast collectors edition:
http://www.magicalgamefactory.com/en/bo ... /?from=950

There is also a 400 pages guide featuring interviews and exclusive art/storyboards.


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