I finally did it

[Angelalex242]

Call it 4 Dragon Rage? Or Pentagulia smasher?

I wonder how much damage it'd do, if you can get Lemina's catastrophe to just over 2000 damage.

...looks like it should 9999. But that'd sorta make it like Erde Kaiser in Xenosaga, and ya know how THAT goes.

Also, it might put a damper on the whole power of humanity thing if you can kick hindquarters and take names with Dragon Power.

[Pisces]

Okay, I'm currently fighting my way through Zophar's domain. I'd post more, but I'm mentally exhausted right now.

Suffice to say I've enjoyed the story very much so far. Especially the sequence with Zophar's revival and Lucia.

[Angelalex242]

Althena's Light, Shine Forth!

[GhaleonOne]

Glad you're liking it! When you get some rest, post more of your reactions. I'm interested in what you've thought of the past 3-4 hours of the game, considering they're some of the most important.

[Pisces]

Okay...

I haven't completed the game yet. I actually tried fighting Zophar last night, and the battle wasn't going my way, but I was able to learn his attacks and am able to form a better strategy at my next try.

As for the story...

The sequence between Lucia and Zophar's revival was easily one of the coolest I've ever seen. I think one of the best moments was the way they did the quick cut the footage between Lucia's face and the quickly-zooming energy blast aimed at Hiro and the others on the Destiny.

Zophar I think is definitely a well developed "essence of evil". He defines the category in that his greatest ability is that of terror and to immobilize hope, which is evident in the character of Lucia. It was nice seeing Lucia's gradual progression over the course of the story, but I always felt that she would have a moment of doubt.

It was very well done how Lucia's actions in the Goddess Tower led to Zophar's power. I know this sounds weird, but there is a line from the movie "The Green Mile", where the character of John Coffey says, "He killed them with their love." It was really weird, but that line actually ran through my head during the moments when Lucia was torn and was captured during her moment of "weakness" protecting Hiro and the others.

Speaking of The Artist Formerly Known as Zophar, I think his appearence in his new "god form" at the end of the game is somehow disturbingly appropriate. It was very unnerving, actually, hearing this deep and reverberating voice associated with this rather androgynous and graceful looking being. It's sort of like hearing the demon's voice come from the litttle girl in "The Exorcist". It has that incongruous effect that makes it somehow more disturbing and powerful.

I think the incongruous effect works well for how Zophar is too -- he is basically the equivalent of Satan or supreme evils in other cultures - and he does not belong in the world because his entire goal is to deny the existence of other "wills" and to conform creation entirely to his own taste. This, in and of itself, is of course "evil" and incongruous with the universe because it is an entirely self-centered drive that not only denies, but refuses to even have recognition for the fact that the universe is a multi-being and multi-willed place. Therefore, I think it's highly appropriate that his appearance creates that kind of awkward effect - Zophar wants to appear divine and beautiful, but he, in essence, is NOT. Supreme Evil fails to recognize that it cannot truly Create - it can only make mockeries of Creation.

And the flaw that Zophar has as the villain and as evil is that he fails to recognize the need for multiple wills - Hiro and the others' strength comes from their need for one another, and that is what makes the moment of Lucia's "break away" from Zophar so powerful - she wanted desperately to believe in humantiy, but she had to truly accept it and believe it in her heart before she could be free of Zophar's influence and his power to terror and create doubt and despair. When Hiro and the others fight Zophar futilely (zero damage, etc) to save their world and to save Lucia, Lucia is moved into believing, thus strenghtening the "truth" that humans need one another - the truth that Zophar cannot be a part of, because of his nature. Thus, it only makes sense that this connection between Lucia's acceptance of the belief and Hiro's actions to save her would free Lucia, strengthen the others, and weaken Zophar.

Other sections of the plot I really enjoyed...

The sequence with Mauri was very touching. That demonstrated another of Zophar's false "truths" and powers - the ability to persecute. It was Zophar who had corrupted Mauri in the first place, but he had her trapped because of her own guilt over what she had done. She refused to "emerge" and be free of Zophar because of Zophar's ability to persecute her for the very things he had begun in her in the first place.

The scene with Luna's last message to Lucia at the top of the Goddess Tower was very nice.

As for Ghaleon...

I was very impressed by the plot surrounding Ghaleon. The entire time, I knew there was something deeper going on. When he appeared on top of the Magic Guild to fight Hiro and was goading him along, I had no doubt about what was truly going on. Ghaleon was trying to get Hiro to overcome Zophar's true powers - the ability to terrorize and create doubt, as I've mentioned above. It was actually very nice to see Ghaleon redeemed, as his actions in SSSC were muddled with the kind of doubt and fear that Zophar inspires. And this game also put into light a lot of what Ghaleon was trying to do in the first game - in many ways, Lucia and Ghaleon start out a lot alike - both of them afraid and full of doubt for humanity's ability - and I like the way they both overcome that. "Zophar" may not have APPEARED in SSSC, but in retrospect, he definitely existed in the hearts of people like Ghaleon. And I really liked the final anime sequence involving Ghaleon and his words to Dyne as he watches the Destiny sail away.


Anyway, I'm going to try fighting Zophar again when I have the chance, soon. I had a question - is it worth trying to destroy a couple of the hands, or is that a waste of time, and should I just focus entirely on staying alive and attacking the main body?

[GhaleonOne]

The guide book says to go straight for the head, but you can defeat, or at least, seriously damage, the front two hands before Lucia breaks free from my understanding. Someone else can probably explain it all better, but you need to make sure you have the Triple Sword attack for Hiro or the battle is almost impossible to win.

And this is what I was hoping to hear from you regarding the game. I've heard you analyze the Chrono series, and FFVII and games like that, and wanted to see what you would get out of the Lunar series if you had played both of them. I think if you had the chance to play the Sega CD originals, you'd find them even more appealing based on the things you're talking about. Especially the actions of Ghaleon in the first game. Anyways, I'll wait and see what you think when you finish the game.

[segaboy7]

yes it is possible to defeat the first two hands of the four as Lucia is going through her speech. After that your on your own because I always found it best to take ouf the left hand then the right hand. Thats just me thou. Anyhow good luck

[Alunissage]

Either works, really. The guide suggested just going all-out on the head. However, you can knock out one or two hands (possibly just the fake ones, I forget) when Lucia is talking just before breaking free and you can't damage the head then, so you may as well reduce the number of things hurting you. I think when I played I took out all the hands first, but that wasn't necessarily the best way.

[Kizyr]

Hehe, now you see why Lunar EB ranks a 100% in my book (and EBC maybe a 95%)! You hit on so many of the points I absolutely love about the game.

And if it makes you feel any better, reading your analysis of FF7 helped me to enjoy Advent Children way more than I would have otherwise. Though, I was kind of watching it passively...

Anywho, go for the hands, I always do. Knock out the one that heals first, then the one that dishes out the most damage. KF

[GhaleonOne]

Yeah, whether defeating the hands makes it harder or not, I'm not sure, but I always have fun taking those hands out. Makes the battle much more fun and bit longer.

[Angelalex242]

Hints from me:

Put Goddess/Warrior on Hiro. It boosts Triple Sword.
Likewise, two magic eye crests on Lemina, and as many gorgon dolls as you have to get her wisdom up as high as you can get it. Milk catastrophe for all it's worth.
Put the Fiend Ring/Tri Ring on Ronfar. You then have an invincible healer once you revive or heal him from his 1 hp. You'll need it.
Leo needs the Spirit Talisman, with his low magic def.
Also, spread your characters out as much as you can. If you're good, you can negate his zone attacks with careful placement of your people.

Don't fight him before level 51. If you don't have Catastrophe and Triple Sword, get 'em.

You can knock out his first two hands with an all out assault. Lucia's gonna heal your MP anyway, so you might as well hit him full throttle.

Just focus all your characters on one hand before the other.

Have Leo use Soul Blade to do damage. It hurts more then Grizzle Blade.
Jean might as well hit both hands with Blue Dragon Fist.
Triple Sword! Catastrophe!
Ronfar's just there to Tranquil Litany till he falls over.

You'll definitely hack one hand off.

[Silver Phoenix]

Save your White Dragon Protect when he's about to cast the most devastating spells. Sometimes the attack will only hit one or two characters, while the rest will still have their protection, to last through another assault or two. I forget, does Lemina have the Magic Shield spell that casts a dome over an area, in EBC? If she does, you can also use that for some added attack spell resistance. For some reason I don't recall her having the spell in the remake, but I could be mistaken.

[Alunissage]

She has a spell of that name, but I don't recall it being the same sort of thing as it was in EB. I think it just raises Mag Def in EBC

[Sonic#]

Right, it's only a Mag Def thing.

Just go for what works for you, Eric. You've played enough games that I think you can get the hang of it.

And I enjoyed the things you pointed out immensely. Especially the explanation concerning Mauri. I hadn't seen it like that before... but it makes lots of sense.

[Pisces]

Well, I defeated Zophar last night and watched the ending, which I thought was very good (I'm a sucker for bittersweet endings.) I'll post more about that later, when I have more time. But I also want to play the Epilogue before I finalize anything.

I do have to say that destroying even the first two "weaker" hands made the battle against Zophar much smoother. Actually, I went ahead and destroyed all four, and it was a piece of cake. I was able to get three of them gone before he started using more of his "instant kill" attacks, and that helped immensely.

Also, I made sure that before the real battle began, I spread everyone way, way out, so that his elemental spells only hit one person instead of a group.

Anyway, I'll post more later.

[Angelalex242]

Heh. Sometimes, belief or the elimination of doubt flowers briefly, only to fade again into time...a moment that shines does not necessarily stretch unending.

[GhaleonOne]

BTW, there's lots to do in the epilouge that you don't neccessarily *have* to do. If you want more, I can post a list of things worth doing.