Tell me of the Dark Scimitar

For discussion of Lunar: Eternal Blue, the original game for the Sega CD
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danth
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Tell me of the Dark Scimitar

Postby danth » Thu Jun 16, 2005 7:02 pm

I've heard some legends about it, but I want to know everything. What have you got? Stories, rumors, pictures, first hand experience? Tell me everything!

Also, I heard in EB there was a ring that would allow you to warp across the battle screen and hit an enemy, without having to walk up to it. Is that true? What was that item called and are there pictures of it?
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Postby Alunissage » Thu Jun 16, 2005 7:34 pm

Good lord, you sound so nosy. Do we really have to do this? It was the source of several flamewars back in the day. Though I suppose the people involved aren't really around now. It's just an item that was in the US manual of EB yet has only been found ingame via a glitch (US version only) which allows one to access unused item data. The end.

There's a ring in EB which allows you to hit all enemies at once for half damage when you use a physical attack. I forget now whether it's Lucia's Tear or the Dimension Ring. Both are items found only in the epilogue of EB. That's the closest I can think of, though people here who know the game better may be able to be more helpful.

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Postby danth » Thu Jun 16, 2005 9:31 pm

Alunissage wrote:Good lord, you sound so nosy. Do we really have to do this?


Whoa, what's your problem? I didn't know that the Dark Scimitar was somebody else's private, personal business that I had no right to ask about. :roll:

Obviously it's a very cool item. I heard it had an auto-kill capability, but that's all I know, besides the fact that it was supposedly only available through a bug. It's sad that someone's personal flamewar (which wasn't what I was asking about, since this is the first time I've heard of it) has overshadowed the actual item itself.

So please, if someone wants to give me details (pics, stats, how to get -- I'm not interested in flame war meta-discussion), that would be much appreciated. Hell, I'd like to hear about ANY cool items from EB that weren't avaiable in the EBC Playsation release, since I never did get to play EB on the Sega CD.
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Postby Alunissage » Thu Jun 16, 2005 10:22 pm

Kindly knock off the sarcasm, because -- as you essentially said -- you don't know what you're talking about. Pretty stupid to join a board and immediately start with smart-aleck remarks.

How to get is a very long story. The site devoted to it is no longer hosted anywhere (except the Internet Archive, but you have to know the original url for that). Activating the glitch is not a simple matter, and describing it to someone who hasn't played the game would be difficult to say the least. It can only be accomplished at certain points in the game and with certain conditions, and there's a strong likelihood of crashing your game with it.

You are mistaken about the auto-kill capability, though I do recall that bit of misinformation being spread. Its interesting ability was that as long as Hiro had MP he would always do critical hits, at some cost -- either continually draining it or 24MP per hit, I forget. It wasn't the most powerful sword and it ate up MP that could be used to far greater effect with Poe Sword, so it was pretty much just a gimmick. There was a far more interesting item in the unused data, but no one knows about it because there was no fuss about it. The only reason the Dark Scimitar is known even now is because of the flamewars; therefore, you're asking about it because of the flamewars whether you knew about them or not.

And before you ask, no, I wasn't involved in any of the fuss; it was before I knew the game existed and I only learned about it a year or so later. But really, look at your post. Just about everyone who asks is asking because they want to know about controversy, not about the inherent properties of the item -- because, as you commented, the controversy overshadowed the item itself long ago. When you ask for stories and rumors no one's going to think you mean solely in the game itself rather than involving the people who found it. And actually the topic was banned here some time ago, I think, though again since most of the people involved have moved on it's not as big a deal. If you'd said at the outset that you were curious about things in the SegaCD game that didn't make it into EBC rather than sounding like you're looking for scandal it wouldn't have been so obnoxious.

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Postby ilovemyguitar » Fri Jun 17, 2005 1:24 am

Alunissage wrote:Kindly knock off the sarcasm, because -- as you essentially said -- you don't know what you're talking about. Pretty stupid to join a board and immediately start with smart-aleck remarks.


Dude, harsh much? You're being a lot ruder than he is.

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Postby Etherest » Fri Jun 17, 2005 3:00 am

I agree. This is just like the first time we had a skirmish, Alunissage.
.....then I sent you an apology that you never replied to... No one's perfect (You already know that)...
Okay, Hacker, listen up. I am tired of your fake assumptions! What is your problem?! Do you just like to mess with 14 year olds, who KNOW they don't lie to people at a site they consider HOME?!! PM ME NOW!

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Postby Genocide » Fri Jun 17, 2005 4:36 am

I guess any discussion about the Dark Scimitar really does go bad. Anyway, read this guide from gamefaqs and it should answer you're questions.

http://db.gamefaqs.com/console/segacd/f ... blue_a.txt

I don't know what's so great about it, since it isnt Hiro's beast weapon.
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Postby ilovemyguitar » Fri Jun 17, 2005 6:25 am

Genocide wrote:I don't know what's so great about it, since it isnt Hiro's beast weapon.


I think it's just all the mystery surrounding it, on account of it being in the manual and all that fun stuff.

I'm actually kind of curious what item Alunissage was referring to, that's "more interesting." My first guess is the Grim Rapier, but then he probably would have called it a different weapon, instead of a different item. But whatever.

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Postby Kizyr » Fri Jun 17, 2005 7:30 am

...Alun, I think you can knock it off already. Give him the benefit of the doubt; not everyone who mentions the Dark Scimitar is looking to revive a flamewar. Considering that all that's years past, there's no justifiable reason to avoid discussing it, especially since the events surrounding it are real interesting. Let me and the other admins worry about making sure the discussion avoids getting heated.

I can post more about it later. It's getting late tonight though and I don't much feel like getting into the subject--the Dark Scimitar, the glitch, or the other items that can be accessed with it.

Oh, but one thing:
danth wrote:Also, I heard in EB there was a ring that would allow you to warp across the battle screen and hit an enemy, without having to walk up to it. Is that true? What was that item called and are there pictures of it?


Dimension Ring. You can find it in Dragon's Nest--during the epilogue I think. I may be mistaken but I remember finding that item and immediately equipping it on Jean; she was the most effective with 3-4 attacks and the ability to warp around. KF
Last edited by Kizyr on Fri Jun 17, 2005 4:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby danth » Fri Jun 17, 2005 7:36 am

Thanks for the info on the Dimension Ring. Now that I hear the name, I remember it.

Anyway, I'm hoping we can just ignore the drama some people associate with the Dark Scimitar and focus on the item itself.

I found an archive of the old DS site. It's got all the info there, so my curiousity is mostly sated. But the archive lacks pictures, so if you've got any, I'd love to see them (IM me if you want).

Sorry if this is a sore subject for some people. I had no idea!
Last edited by danth on Sat Jun 18, 2005 5:51 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby Alunissage » Fri Jun 17, 2005 8:20 pm

*sigh*

I admit it, I made an incorrect assumption about the purpose of the original post. I think it’s understandable why I did, though. Given its history (and the fact that it’s not a particularly fascinating object in itself), a request for legends, stories, rumors, and “tell me everything!” certainly sounded like the author was wanting to dig up dirt. It never occurred to me that someone would hear of it and think that it was legendary because of its inherent properties as an item. My comment about sounding nosy was more about the breathless excitement of the post itself, though.

I didn't know that the Dark Scimitar was somebody else's private, personal business that I had no right to ask about. :roll:

This is the sarcasm that I felt was uncalled-for, especially from a new member. There is no reason to assume that it’s private, personal business (flamewars usually aren’t private by nature), and so it was an inappropriate remark. The rest of my post after asking him to knock it off did provide the information he requested, and I think that two other people posting solely to criticize my response to the above was also uncalled-for. (Etherest, I saw and appreciated your apology, but didn’t think a response was necessary.)

Actually, I do find discussion of the Dark Scimitar (guess I can’t call it the DS any more, heh) pretty interesting -- when I first found the DS grotto in Feb 2000 I printed out nearly the entire thing. Which means I have most of the pictures, but only as printouts. Someday I hope to scan them back in, but I haven’t done any scanning in a year. My main reaction was to the tone of the first post, and my secondary reaction to the tone of the second; without that first line I’d have been a lot more open to discussing it. I’m sorry for the overreaction.

I'm actually kind of curious what item Alunissage was referring to, that's "more interesting." My first guess is the Grim Rapier, but then he probably would have called it a different weapon, instead of a different item.

The interesting object I was referring to was...well, I can’t remember its name, if it even has one (I think they called it F-96 or something like that). It’s a "weapon" that adds no attack power at all -- but increases the number of attacks by 96. That’s right, Hiro does 98 bare-handed attacks. The person who created the Grotto said that it’s worth fiddling with the glitch forever to get that, and I’m inclined to agree. If I ever get around to playing it in English again I definitely intend to try for it.

Oh, and I sincerely hope you’re not referring to me by that “he”. :P

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Postby GhaleonOne » Fri Jun 17, 2005 8:37 pm

Thing is, anyone who wasn't on the Working Designs forum during that ordeal doesn't realize what the problem is. I personally have no problems with people discussing it here, but if it turns to flaming from the past incident (incident is a bit weak of a word to call it though :P) I'll lock it. There used to be a LOT of topics about this item before that ordeal, and I see no problem to let the topic continue, just so long as it doesn't get out of hand.
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Postby ilovemyguitar » Fri Jun 17, 2005 9:36 pm

GhaleonOne wrote:Thing is, anyone who wasn't on the Working Designs forum during that ordeal doesn't realize what the problem is.


Well, I have to admit, I'm kinda curious just what exactly the arguments were about. (I have zero desire to actually *participate* in such a war; that would just be silly.) Was it between people who believed the Dark Scimitar existed within the game, and those who didn't?

I totally understand if this is too touchy to go into, but my curiousity has definately been peaked.

Alunissage wrote:Oh, and I sincerely hope you’re not referring to me by that “he”. :P


Haha, sorry about that.

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Postby Alunissage » Fri Jun 17, 2005 10:28 pm

That's pretty much what it was. The question was first whether it existed and then (after it had been found via the Lemina Bug) whether it's accessible in the game through normal play. WD didn't want to answer one way or another, and some of the fans kept pushing for an answer -- two cases of stubbornness going head-to-head. I wasn't around then and don't know exactly how that led to flamewars between the fans, other than that some people were telling others to drop it already. But that's what the issue was. WD is an odd blend of openness and extreme reticence, and the latter quality was very much at work.

And, I don't say this to be mean or vengeful, but the word is "piqued".

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Postby Etherest » Sat Jun 18, 2005 2:17 am

and I think that two other people posting solely to criticize my response to the above was also uncalled-for. (Etherest, I saw and appreciated your apology, but didn’t think a response was necessary.)

Sorry...I looked back and noticed how that was uncalled-for. But thanks for your appreciation to my apology. ( I thought I was being given the cold shoulder or something...but I always say I'm wrong most of the time and, hey, I was wrong again. )
Okay, Hacker, listen up. I am tired of your fake assumptions! What is your problem?! Do you just like to mess with 14 year olds, who KNOW they don't lie to people at a site they consider HOME?!! PM ME NOW!

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Postby danth » Sat Jun 18, 2005 2:45 am

ilovemyguitar wrote:I totally understand if this is too touchy to go into, but my curiousity has definately been peaked.


I don't know if you saw the link I posted, so I went back and put it in bold. It's got everything on the Dark Scimitar, including (if you really want it) some info on the online drama surrounding it.

Oh yeah, the archive doesn't have pictures, so if you got any...share! :)
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Postby Alunissage » Sat Jun 18, 2005 2:51 am

I'll check when I get home and see if I managed to salvage any images from it. There was an earlier location of the grotto (which is what I looked up, from the url on my printout) and so I looked at several archives of it and I think I got a couple of images...they might not have been the useful ones, though. I hope you see why I balked at trying to explain exactly how to get it now. :)

Apology accepted. Thanks.

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Postby Kizyr » Sat Jun 18, 2005 9:20 am

The Lemina Bug is sort of a debug code you can fiddle around with by levelling up someone's magic, then switching back to a previous character with fewer magic slots. It's actually a bit complicated, and there was a lot of excitement when it was first discovered.

Eventually the bug yielded a few items in the game data only, but not in the final product. The Dark Scimitar is the most well-known, but that #ATK+98 item is by far the most interesting. There're a few others here and there, and a great deal that will just make your game freeze.

The effects and all that other info was already posted, so no sense repeating it. I was around on the Shrine to Ghaleon boards when the bug was being explored / exploited. I was also sort of a catalyst for the two folks who discovered the DS working together in the first place, but that was by accident. KF
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Postby Rune Lai » Sun Jun 19, 2005 2:04 am

For archival purposes (hey, it was a memorable moment in Lunar fan history) I still have the original message board thread that announced the discovery of the Dark Scimitar. Ah, we were so enthusiastic about having found it...

It's not much and the external links no longer work, but it can be found here:

http://www.sabrecat.net/ghaleon/memorabl/scimitar.html

It doesn't really shed any light about anything, but it's pre-flame war so you can see how we had hoped things would go.
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Postby netequevaris » Wed Jun 22, 2005 1:38 pm

It's clearly not the same thing as finding the weapon in game (or using the bug), but I did manage to get the item by hacking a brm. I also found out how to do that on the iso file, but there are problems with that method. The admins of the site were kind enough to share the information about how to hack the brm file and to host a hacked brm file on the LEB site.

The Dark Scimitar is fun to use, especially on a hacked Hiro, but there are other weapons with the *Kill attack* (for Leo, it's the *Dragon attack*), but they do not trigger all the time.


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