First draft of "Differences" sections

For discussion of Lunar: The Silver Star, the original game for the Sega CD
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Kizyr
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First draft of "Differences" sections

Postby Kizyr » Thu Sep 27, 2007 9:29 pm

Hi folks. I'm in the midst of working on a 'differences' section. I'd like to post up a draft here to see what folks think thus far, maybe have some feedback.

First, this is just the draft, so it's only text. Everything here will be formatted later into an easier-to-follow form. Here's what the format of the draft is:

[Type]) [Screenshots]
E: [English version]
J: [Japanese version]

"Type" is one of six numbers, describing what kind of difference it is between the games:
1) Major changes: Very noticeable, and intentional
2) Minor changes: Not story-impacting, but usually intentional
3) Translation ambiguities: Ambiguities in English or Japanese version
4) Name clarifications: Changes or clarifications in names and titles
5) Miscellaneous changes
6) Equal

So here's the kind of feedback that I'd like:
- Are any of these just pointless clarifications that can be taken out?
- Are any of these more interesting in particular than others?
- Are any of them maybe classified one way that should be classified as another?
- Are there any differences that aren't here, that you think should be?
- Or, any other comments you might have...

Anyway, here's the list:
_______________________________________________

1) TSS_E_019.jpg TSS_J_048.jpg
E: NPC dialogue says Governer Mel 'founded' the city of Meribia.
J: NPC dialogue says Governer Mel 'governs' the city of Meribia. The mistranslated word is 'osameru'. "The large city of Meribia on the continent is governed by Master Mel, one of the Four Heroes."

1) TSS_E_190.jpg TSS_E_191.jpg TSS_J_245.jpg TSS_J_246.jpg
E: The Meryod townsfolk are made to sound like 'rednecks'.
J: The Meryod townsfolk sound normal.

1) TSS_E_247.jpg TSS_J_286.jpg
E: Transport pads were starfleet-like symbols.
J: Transport pads were pentagrams.

1) TSS_E_302.jpg TSS_J_357.jpg
E: Myght is sensitive about his body odor.
J: Myght is just a hermit. "Myght is a hermit. So, the fewer people to see him, the better... All right, Alex, just you should come."

1) TSS_E_307.jpg TSS_E_308.jpg
E: Myght has Lytonians around because they can't smell.
J: Nothing about Lytonians not smelling, just that Myght feels comfortable around them despite being a hermit. "We came from the village of Lyton. We are Myght's assistants. Myght is a hermit, but, he is kind to us."

1) TSS_J_630.jpg
E: Alex must play his harp, or Luna's blasts will kill him on the way up.
J: Alex does not have to play the harp to save Luna.

2) TSS_J_027.jpg
E: Quark calls himself Tetrarch of the Dragon Tribe
J: Quark doesn't give himself any title

2) TSS_E_013.jpg TSS_J_030.jpg TSS_J_031.jpg
E: Quark mentions that he feels his and Luna's souls are intertwined.
J: Quark doesn't mention anything specific about Luna. "I noticed you before, the girl over there. Perhaps... ...no, it's nothing. I was just surprised that a young girl came to this kind of a place."

2) TSS_J_087.jpg TSS_J_088.jpg
E: The guy at the Vane Springs asks about how many licks does it take to get to the center of a tootsie roll pop.
J: The guy at the Vane Springs is an absent-minded adventurer. "The town that floats in the sky... Hmm... I have memories of it from some adventures here and there from long ago... But it's no good... I don't remember it. Who in the world am I?"

2) TSS_E_061.jpg TSS_J_121.jpg
E: The first Dragonmaster used Dragon Magic to transform Lunar
J: Nothing was specifically mentioned about Dragon Magic being used by the Dragonmaster to transform Lunar (note: other editions of Lunar clarified that Althena was the one who, with the help of the first Dragonmaster and the Four Dragons, transformed Lunar into a life-harboring place). "But, this world was transformed into a land of green through the first Dragonmaster, spoken of in legends."

2) TSS_J_151.jpg
E: Jessica asks "Why does every RPG have to have at least one worthless drunk?"
J: The same guy is still drunk, only Jessica doesn't mention 'RPG'. "Why are men all so worthless? Don't act so friendly with me!!"

2) TSS_E_117.jpg TSS_E_118.jpg TSS_E_119.jpg TSS_E_120.jpg TSS_E_121.jpg TSS_E_122.jpg TSS_J_183.jpg TSS_J_184.jpg
E: The old hag on Caldor Isle is suspicious of Ghaleon.
J: The old hag on Caldor Isle thinks Ghaleon's hot. "Ghaleon's a fine man. If I were just a bit younger... Yes, about 170 years younger, then I'd go for him... Hee hee hee..."

2) TSS_E_149.jpg TSS_E_150.jpg TSS_E_151.jpg TSS_E_152.jpg TSS_E_153.jpg TSS_E_154.jpg TSS_E_155.jpg TSS_E_156.jpg TSS_J_209.jpg TSS_J_210.jpg TSS_J_211.jpg TSS_J_212.jpg TSS_J_213.jpg
E: Ghaleon's diary entry is dated "12 Altar '34"
J: Ghaleon's diary entry has no date. "......Lemia has refused to assist me. Now, there is no other alternative but to seal away Lemia's memory with magic... I'll throw Lemia into the underground dungeon, and summon the witch Xenobia... Thus, Vane will be taken care of. After that, all I must concern myself with is the White Dragon, Mel, and... the Goddess living in the human world..."

2) TSS_J_230.jpg
E: One of the guys in the Nanza cave is a lawyer.
J: The same guy in the Nanza cave is a snake-oil salesman. "This guy is selling dangerous medicine, even now."

2) TSS_E_194.jpg TSS_E_195.jpg TSS_J_248.jpg TSS_J_249.jpg
E: Book in Damon's spire prophecizes a green-eyed Dragonmaster
J: Book in Damon's spire is more cryptic. "All the world's fate began with Dragonmaster Dyne... But, all the world's fate will be let go and ended by Dragonmaster Dyne."

2) TSS_E_197.jpg TSS_E_198.jpg TSS_J_250.jpg TSS_J_251.jpg
E: Book in Damon's spire claims there can only be one Dragonmaster at a time.
J: No claim to there being only one Dragonmaster at a time. "The appearance of a Dragonmaster is an unlimited ray of hope. A Dragonmaster fights with the unbelievable strength of two shadows [literal]."

2) TSS_E_200.jpg TSS_E_201.jpg TSS_J_252.jpg TSS_J_253.jpg
E: Book in Damon's spire mentions the world losing power when the last of the Dragon Tribe dies.
J: Book in Damon's spire mentions the world losing a symbol of magic with the death of Quark/Fidy in particular, who was the last of the Dragons. "When the last dragon Quark dies and the world loses a symbol of magic power... the path to be a Dragonmaster is closed, and the Goddess is wrapped in darkness."

2) TSS_E_208.jpg TSS_E_209.jpg TSS_J_256.jpg TSS_J_257.jpg
E: Book in Damon's spire prophecises betrayal and friendship.
J: Same book in Damon's spire doesn't say anything serious. "Everything written in this book is a lie. ...but then, was the last statement true? Or was that also a lie?"

2) TSS_E_214.jpg TSS_E_215.jpg TSS_J_260.jpg TSS_J_261.jpg
E: Book in Damon's spire talks about prophecy from the Blue Star.
J: Book in Damon's spire talks about the Blue Star itself. "The legendary Blue Star shining in the heavens. Before long, it will bring about humanity's hope and salvation."

2) TSS_J_262.jpg TSS_J_263.jpg
E: No explicit mention of Luna being, or not being, the Goddess until the Frontier.
J: Book in Damon's spire mentions Luna being a human. "The girl Luna, born in Burg, is not the Goddess Althena. The existence of the name of Luna is most certainly human."

2) TSS_E_321.jpg TSS_E_322.jpg TSS_E_323.jpg TSS_E_324.jpg TSS_E_325.jpg TSS_E_326.jpg TSS_E_327.jpg TSS_E_328.jpg TSS_J_382.jpg TSS_J_383.jpg TSS_J_384.jpg TSS_J_387.jpg TSS_J_388.jpg
E: Nash is injured, but speaks normally, when he returns at Tamur.
J: Nash is injured and has broken speech when he returns at Tamur. "You're... here... I know... how to go to the Frontier... where Ghaleon is... You can go... through a transport spring between... the village... of Meryod... and... the village of Lyton... You need the Water of Mirage... that the Plains Tribe... has... to use... the spring... I got hurt when... I escaped... from the witch Xe... nobia... Alex... quickly, to the... Plains..."

2) TSS_E_408.jpg TSS_E_409.jpg TSS_J_492.jpg TSS_J_493.jpg
E: A person in Marke seems to know Nall by name.
J: No one in Marke knows Nall by name. Rather, someone recognizes the wings, perhaps as those of a white dragon. "Whoa!? That white animal with the wings... Oh no, my mistake. I haven't seen that for some tens of years now..."

2) TSS_E_412.jpg TSS_J_495.jpg
E: Claim that half-beast half-humans don't have same emotions.
J: No claim that emotions are different across races. "I may be a beastman, but your words still move my heart... I wonder why is that?"

2) TSS_E_475.jpg TSS_E_476.jpg TSS_E_477.jpg TSS_J_599.jpg TSS_J_600.jpg
E: Ghaleon captured the pixies because he likes them, allegedly.
J: Ghaleon helped the pixies, allegedly, because they were about to die out in the Frontier. "We pixies who lived in the Frontier were about to die out. But, Master Ghaleon helped us."

2) TSS_E_488.jpg TSS_E_489.jpg
E: The Dragon Angels refer to themselves as 'gods of compassion'.
J: The Dragon Angels don't refer to themselves as anything specific. "If this continues, then all magic power will be lost. The world will return to a world of death, and be destroyed... Stopping this is already beyond even the power of a Dragonmaster..."

3) TSS_E_018.jpg TSS_J_040.jpg
E: Laike says, when he meets you, "You kids must be the ones from Burg!"
J: Laike is less specific. "Oh... You all are people from the village of Burg..."

3) TSS_E_033.jpg TSS_J_065.jpg
E: All of the magicians of Vane are members of the Magic Guild.
J: All of the residents of Vane are implied to be magicians in the Magic Guild. "The residents of Vane have all entered the Magic Guild as magicians."

3) TSS_E_066.jpg TSS_J_125.jpg TSS_J_126.jpg
E: The founders of Vane are said to be long dead
J: The people who know how Vane floats are no longer around. "Those who understand how Vane floats in the heavens are no longer. Only the sparkle of them remains."

3) TSS_E_070.jpg TSS_J_130.jpg
E: The light of Althena does not reach the Frontier
J: The light of the Blue Star does not reach the Frontier (nor does Althena's power reach it). "At the edge of this world stretches the land of the Frontier, where the Blue Star in the heavens does not shine."

3) TSS_E_071.jpg TSS_J_131.jpg
E: Althena is immortal and lives in the Goddess Tower
J: Althena continues her rebirths, thereby remaining young, and lives in the Goddess Tower. "The Goddess Althena resides in the Goddess Tower at the heart of the world, continuing her rebirths, and always just as beautiful."

3) TSS_E_078.jpg TSS_J_137.jpg
E: No one knows where are the ruins of the Magic Empire (the empire which, a long time ago, tried to revolt against Althena)
J: No one knows anymore where the Magic Empire was. "There is no longer anyone who knows where the Magic Empire was."

3) TSS_E_079.jpg TSS_J_138.jpg
E: Vane floated into the sky as a result of the Goddess' Tears
J: Vane floated into the sky when the Goddess' Tears flowed. "When the Goddess' Tears which covered the world flowed, Vane floated into the sky."

3) TSS_E_088.jpg TSS_J_159.jpg
E: Vane's activities are controlled from the Star Chamber
J: Vane's magic power is controlled from the Star Chamber. "This Star Chamber is the place where Vane's magic power is controlled..."

3) TSS_E_227.jpg
E: Book in Damon's spire prophecizes a powerful person.
J: Book in Damon's spire talks about the strength of the Magic Emperor Ghaleon. "Ghaleon, who calls himself the Magic Emperor, has strong magic power."

3) TSS_E_304.jpg TSS_E_305.jpg TSS_J_359.jpg
E: Mia's belief in Nash mistakes the context, making it sound like Nash has already returned and Mia's asking Alex to believe him.
J: Mia's belief in Nash is more general, that she has faith in him. "I still believe in Nash. That's why, Alex... [you should as well]"

3) TSS_E_337.jpg TSS_E_338.jpg TSS_J_408.jpg TSS_J_409.jpg
E: Althena provided a seal to the cave to seal the fiend in.
J: Althena provided a mysterious stone, which was the seal that kept the fiend in the cave. "Long ago, a demon which spread disease was sealed in a cave by the Goddess Althena's power. The thing that sealed the demon is a mysterious stone that is called the Goddess's Seal."

3) TSS_E_406.jpg TSS_J_488.jpg
E: The people of Marke welcome 'would-be Dragonmasters'.
J: The people of Marke seem to welcome Alex as a future Dragonmaster. "This is the village of Marke. Welcome, you who could be Dragonmaster."

4) TSS_J_024.jpg
E: First island is called Caldor Isle
J: First island is called Honmel Isle

4) TSS_J_027.jpg
E: White Dragon is named Quark
J: White Dragon is named Fidy

4) TSS_J_053.jpg
E: Gambler's name is Brett
J: Gambler's name is Krysa [kuraisa]

4) TSS_E_022.jpg TSS_J_046.jpg
E: Lemia Ausa is referred to as leader of the magic guild.
J: Lemia Ausa (Lemilia Ausa in Japanese version) is referred to as leader of the magic guild; the word used is 'shuutou'.

4) TSS_E_023.jpg TSS_J_047.jpg
E: Ghaleon is called the Premier of the city of Vane.
J: Ghaleon is called the Premier of the city of Vane; the word used for Premier is 'saishou' (also can mean Prime Minister)

4) TSS_J_054.jpg
E: Nash is a Level 3 apprentice
J: Nash is a third-year student in the Magic Guild of Vane

4) TSS_E_082.jpg TSS_J_147.jpg
E: Ghaleon's assistant is named Glumm
J: Ghaleon's assistant isn't given a name.

4) TSS_J_152.jpg
E: The false Dragonmaster on Lann Isle is named 'Zoc'
J: The false Dragonmaster on Lann Isle has no name

4) TSS_J_158.jpg
E: Permanent stat-raising item called 'Dover Nut'
J: Permanent stat-raising item called 'Protection Nut'

4) TSS_E_105.jpg TSS_J_171.jpg
E: Mel's nickname was Deadly Mel
J: Mel's nickname was Blood-soaked Mel. "When he was young, he was very ferocious. As a warrior, he was called Blood-soaked Mel."

4) TSS_E_289.jpg TSS_E_290.jpg TSS_J_344.jpg
E: Prarie tribe names: Fresca (Franchesca) and her husband Tempest.
J: Prarie tribe names: Pilya and Temujin

4) TSS_E_331.jpg TSS_E_332.jpg TSS_J_401.jpg TSS_J_402.jpg
E: A fiend named Grissel came here 5000 years ago.
J: A fiend, unnamed, came here 5000 years ago. "5000 years ago... an ancient demon came to the Plains and spread disease. This plague is the curse of that demon..."

4) TSS_E_348.jpg TSS_J_415.jpg
E: The cave is called Grimzol's Cave.
J: The cave is called the Demon's Cave.

4) TSS_E_350.jpg TSS_J_416.jpg
E: The boss in Grimzol's Cave is called the 'Inca God' by Nall.
J: The boss in the Demon's Cave is called Karal [kararu] by Nall.

4) TSS_E_351.jpg TSS_J_417.jpg
E: Tempest calls the boss in Grimzol's Cave Grimzol.
J: Tempest calls the boss in the Demon's Cave a demon.

4) TSS_E_484.jpg TSS_J_617.jpg
E: The two creatures who gave Alex the sword are the Dragon Angels.
J: The two creatures who gave Alex the sword are called just Angels.

5) TSS_J_001.jpg
E: No title screen with text
J: Splash screen with odd intro text

5) TSS_J_004.jpg
E: No captions for spoken dialogue
J: Captions for all spoken dialogue

5) TSS_E_129.jpg TSS_J_189.jpg
E: Alex actually has a bit of dialogue.
J: Alex has almost no dialogue.

5) TSS_J_480.jpg
E: n/a
J: Need to investigate this. 'enyakora' might be a contemporary or anachronistic reference.

5) TSS_J_629.jpg TSS_J_630.jpg
E: Double-meaning of words couldn't be translated.
J: Double-meaning of the word 'koto': refers to Alex's harp, and Alex himself. So, Luna/Althena is able to imply both Alex's harp and the personage of Alex. "...!? Harp [koto]...? A harp's sound? I can hear it... Alex!? ... Alex? I feel you... Alex's being [koto]... Ah, Alex..."

6) TSS_E_038.jpg TSS_J_103.jpg
E: Vane is implied to be 1000 years old
J: Vane is implied to be 1000 years old. "Vane here has been continuing magic research for as long as 1000 years."

6) TSS_E_055.jpg TSS_E_057.jpg TSS_E_058.jpg TSS_J_101.jpg TSS_J_102.jpg
E: The Vile Tribe roamed about 500 years ago, but Althena banished them to the Frontier.
J: The Vile Tribe roamed about 500 years ago, but Althena sealed them in the Frontier. "500 years ago, the Vile Tribe, who tormented people, lived in this world. But, the Goddess Althena, for the sake of the people, banished the Vile Tribe to the Frontier and sealed them there."

6) TSS_E_097.jpg TSS_J_168.jpg
E: Vane has a 1000 year history.
J: Vane has a 1000 year history. "Vane, which is based on 1000 years of history, [has been attacked by] the Vile Tribe...!? This is not the time for classes."

6) TSS_E_110.jpg TSS_J_174.jpg
E: Jessica's full name is Jessica Alkirk.
J: Jessica's full name is Jessica Alkirk.

6) TSS_E_123.jpg TSS_J_186.jpg
E: Ramus left Burg with someone named Fulari.
J: Ramus left Burg with someone named Fulari.

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DezoPenguin
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Re: First draft of "Differences" sections

Postby DezoPenguin » Thu Sep 27, 2007 11:03 pm

Kizyr wrote:
So here's the kind of feedback that I'd like:
- Are any of these just pointless clarifications that can be taken out?


Okay, honestly, the entire section 6 can just go out. If you have a comprehensive list of what's different, then there's no point in having a list of stuff that's not different. I guess the only question would be if the list isn't comprehensive, in which case the "equal" entries could be valuable.


Kizyr wrote:2) TSS_E_197.jpg TSS_E_198.jpg TSS_J_250.jpg TSS_J_251.jpg
E: Book in Damon's spire claims there can only be one Dragonmaster at a time.
J: No claim to there being only one Dragonmaster at a time. "The appearance of a Dragonmaster is an unlimited ray of hope. A Dragonmaster fights with the unbelievable strength of two shadows [literal]."


Is "fights with the strength of two shadows" an idiom in Japanese, and if so, what does it mean? If it isn't and idiom, then you can change that last question to "what the fragging heck does that mean?" :)

Kizyr wrote:2) TSS_J_262.jpg TSS_J_263.jpg
E: No explicit mention of Luna being, or not being, the Goddess until the Frontier.
J: Book in Damon's spire mentions Luna being a human. "The girl Luna, born in Burg, is not the Goddess Althena. The existence of the name of Luna is most certainly human."


Damon archives books containing out and out lies? Or am I missing something?

Kizyr wrote:3) TSS_E_018.jpg TSS_J_040.jpg
E: Laike says, when he meets you, "You kids must be the ones from Burg!"
J: Laike is less specific. "Oh... You all are people from the village of Burg..."


I'd think this would be a "pointless clarification," IMHO. The added specificity seems more stylization than anything (especially since it's pretty well-nigh impossible that Dyne doesn't know Nall on sight...).

Kizyr wrote:3) TSS_E_066.jpg TSS_J_125.jpg TSS_J_126.jpg
E: The founders of Vane are said to be long dead
J: The people who know how Vane floats are no longer around. "Those who understand how Vane floats in the heavens are no longer. Only the sparkle of them remains."


Another pointless clarification, I think. "Are no longer"--as opposed to "Are no longer here"--pretty much equals "dead"

Kizyr wrote:3) TSS_E_078.jpg TSS_J_137.jpg
E: No one knows where are the ruins of the Magic Empire (the empire which, a long time ago, tried to revolt against Althena)
J: No one knows anymore where the Magic Empire was. "There is no longer anyone who knows where the Magic Empire was."


Is this listed because the English version implies that there's something tangible (i.e. "ruins") that could be found if one looked in the right place?

Kizyr wrote:3) TSS_E_079.jpg TSS_J_138.jpg
E: Vane floated into the sky as a result of the Goddess' Tears
J: Vane floated into the sky when the Goddess' Tears flowed. "When the Goddess' Tears which covered the world flowed, Vane floated into the sky."


So what's different about the two?

Kizyr wrote:3) TSS_E_337.jpg TSS_E_338.jpg TSS_J_408.jpg TSS_J_409.jpg
E: Althena provided a seal to the cave to seal the fiend in.
J: Althena provided a mysterious stone, which was the seal that kept the fiend in the cave. "Long ago, a demon which spread disease was sealed in a cave by the Goddess Althena's power. The thing that sealed the demon is a mysterious stone that is called the Goddess's Seal."


Is the difference that the Japanese version specifically identifies the seal as being a "mysterious stone" while is left undescribed in English?

Kizyr wrote:4) TSS_E_022.jpg TSS_J_046.jpg
E: Lemia Ausa is referred to as leader of the magic guild.
J: Lemia Ausa (Lemilia Ausa in Japanese version) is referred to as leader of the magic guild; the word used is 'shuutou'.

4) TSS_E_023.jpg TSS_J_047.jpg
E: Ghaleon is called the Premier of the city of Vane.
J: Ghaleon is called the Premier of the city of Vane; the word used for Premier is 'saishou' (also can mean Prime Minister)


So what's different between the two versions? Especially since "Premier" and "Prime Minister" can actually be used interchangably sometimes in English as well...

By the way, I'd just like to go on record now as saying "Woo-hoo!" and "Thanks!" for undertaking this otherwise thankless task of cataloging all this data for the benefit of curious and obsessive fan types like myself.

:D

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Postby phyco126 » Thu Sep 27, 2007 11:31 pm

Question, I presume that the final draft will be on the website itself.

Second, would this information not help the dictionary/encyclypedia (butchered that one, whoops ^^; ) ? For instance, I want to know more about this Grissel character. The information listed above could easily be copied or paraphrased into it, so when I search for him/she/it/whatever I can find what I am looking for?

Just curious, for no real reason.
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Postby Alunissage » Fri Sep 28, 2007 6:39 am

Yes, it'll be there. I've been planning to write up differences between versions for, oh, six years or so now, so certainly some of this will be in the encyclopedia. Grimzol/Grissel is one of many names that require an entry.

I haven't yet looked through the list Kizyr posted and probably won't be able to tonight, but I'm looking forward to it. I should add that I think the equivalency section is a good thing to have, because there are often things that people think were changed in translation which weren't and those are worth mentioning. JWL did a list of differences between US and JP versions of EB and he included a list of things that weren't changed, which I thought was interesting. I also don't have a problem with pointless clarifications. ^_^

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Kizyr
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Re: First draft of "Differences" sections

Postby Kizyr » Sat Sep 29, 2007 3:35 am

DezoPenguin wrote:Okay, honestly, the entire section 6 can just go out. If you have a comprehensive list of what's different, then there's no point in having a list of stuff that's not different. I guess the only question would be if the list isn't comprehensive, in which case the "equal" entries could be valuable.


Well the list obviously isn't comprehensive. That'd be the same thing as just listing all the dialogue from both games.

The purpose of the 'equal' section is based off of some things I've seen over the years that folks have theorized or wondered if they were different between the English and Japanese versions. There are really only a handful I think would come up--such as the age of Vane or when the Magic Empire was around--that I think folks would really want to know is corroborated in both versions.

However, it's pretty safe to assume that if it isn't mentioned here, then it's equivalent between the two versions of the game.

That being said, there still is room to trim out some of the "6" section.

Is "fights with the strength of two shadows" an idiom in Japanese, and if so, what does it mean? If it isn't and idiom, then you can change that last question to "what the fragging heck does that mean?" :)


I was trying to figure this all out myself. I've never heard that idiom before, so I'd rather not take a stab at what it could mean (Googling it didn't help too much, I just got responses about having multiple light sources.)

It probably just means that he fought with the strength of multiple men or something.

Kizyr wrote:2) TSS_J_262.jpg TSS_J_263.jpg
E: No explicit mention of Luna being, or not being, the Goddess until the Frontier.
J: Book in Damon's spire mentions Luna being a human. "The girl Luna, born in Burg, is not the Goddess Althena. The existence of the name of Luna is most certainly human."


Damon archives books containing out and out lies? Or am I missing something?


Well, the implication of that book is that Luna isn't the same thing as Althena, but Luna is only the human form, and Luna is not a Goddess herself. I mean it doesn't explicitly make sense until the end of the game, so it's an added layer of ambiguity at this point.


Kizyr wrote:I'd think this would be a "pointless clarification," IMHO. The added specificity seems more stylization than anything (especially since it's pretty well-nigh impossible that Dyne doesn't know Nall on sight...).


Yeah, I can cut that one out.

3) TSS_E_066.jpg TSS_J_125.jpg TSS_J_126.jpg
E: The founders of Vane are said to be long dead
J: The people who know how Vane floats are no longer around. "Those who understand how Vane floats in the heavens are no longer. Only the sparkle of them remains."


Another pointless clarification, I think. "Are no longer"--as opposed to "Are no longer here"--pretty much equals "dead"


That wasn't the point; the distinction was between the people who founded Vane, and those who know how it floats. It's still probably splitting hairs, though.

Is this listed because the English version implies that there's something tangible (i.e. "ruins") that could be found if one looked in the right place?


That was sort of the idea--the idea that there's no longer something tangible, but not so much that they could be found. Should it just be cut?

Kizyr wrote:3) TSS_E_079.jpg TSS_J_138.jpg
E: Vane floated into the sky as a result of the Goddess' Tears
J: Vane floated into the sky when the Goddess' Tears flowed. "When the Goddess' Tears which covered the world flowed, Vane floated into the sky."

So what's different about the two?


The English version has causality--the tears are what lifted Vane up (it makes sense looking at the English text--which is in the screenshot anyway, so it won't be explicitly typed out). The Japanese version doesn't say that the tears caused Vane to float, only that Vane floated when the tears flooded.

Kizyr wrote:3) TSS_E_337.jpg TSS_E_338.jpg TSS_J_408.jpg TSS_J_409.jpg
E: Althena provided a seal to the cave to seal the fiend in.
J: Althena provided a mysterious stone, which was the seal that kept the fiend in the cave. "Long ago, a demon which spread disease was sealed in a cave by the Goddess Althena's power. The thing that sealed the demon is a mysterious stone that is called the Goddess's Seal."

Is the difference that the Japanese version specifically identifies the seal as being a "mysterious stone" while is left undescribed in English?


Yeah, that was the idea.

Kizyr wrote:4) TSS_E_022.jpg TSS_J_046.jpg
E: Lemia Ausa is referred to as leader of the magic guild.
J: Lemia Ausa (Lemilia Ausa in Japanese version) is referred to as leader of the magic guild; the word used is 'shuutou'.

4) TSS_E_023.jpg TSS_J_047.jpg
E: Ghaleon is called the Premier of the city of Vane.
J: Ghaleon is called the Premier of the city of Vane; the word used for Premier is 'saishou' (also can mean Prime Minister)

So what's different between the two versions? Especially since "Premier" and "Prime Minister" can actually be used interchangably sometimes in English as well...


Nothing is different. I wanted to record what word was used to translate over as Premier. I'll probably be a bit more judicious about what goes in the "Section 4" though, so this might still be axed.

By the way, I'd just like to go on record now as saying "Woo-hoo!" and "Thanks!" for undertaking this otherwise thankless task of cataloging all this data for the benefit of curious and obsessive fan types like myself.

:D


Thanks {^^}.

Alun wrote:I haven't yet looked through the list Kizyr posted and probably won't be able to tonight, but I'm looking forward to it. I should add that I think the equivalency section is a good thing to have, because there are often things that people think were changed in translation which weren't and those are worth mentioning.


Yeah that's kind of the idea behind Section 6. The thing is, most of the translation is really well done and accurately portrayed. So, I want to stick with only pointing out those things that are the same that folks may assume to be something that was changed. KF

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Postby Alunissage » Sat Sep 29, 2007 7:34 am

Okay, finally had time to type up my notes on these. Sorry if some of it's redundant. I didn't really think about the categorizing, though. I'd be inclined to distinguish between dialogue differences and gameplay/presentation differences, such as the names of items and spells, and the harp thing.

Some of these are just comments on the content which you may or may not want to include in your list.

Kizyr wrote:1) TSS_E_019.jpg TSS_J_048.jpg
E: NPC dialogue says Governer Mel 'founded' the city of Meribia.
J: NPC dialogue says Governer Mel 'governs' the city of Meribia. The mistranslated word is 'osameru'. "The large city of Meribia on the continent is governed by Master Mel, one of the Four Heroes."

This is good to know, because it didn’t make sense with his wife being a noblewoman of the city and his having been a pirate when he fought Dyne. (Though now I forget if all of that is in the original.)

1) TSS_E_190.jpg TSS_E_191.jpg TSS_J_245.jpg TSS_J_246.jpg
E: The Meryod townsfolk are made to sound like 'rednecks'.
J: The Meryod townsfolk sound normal.

Is there a reference to Meryod having burned down in the Japanese EB?

1) TSS_E_247.jpg TSS_J_286.jpg
E: Transport pads were starfleet-like symbols.
J: Transport pads were pentagrams.

This change was made at Sega’s behest, which is why they’re pentagrams in the US remakes.

1) TSS_E_302.jpg TSS_J_357.jpg
E: Myght is sensitive about his body odor.
J: Myght is just a hermit. "Myght is a hermit. So, the fewer people to see him, the better... All right, Alex,
just you should come."

This change is mentioned in the Making of SSSC.

1) TSS_J_630.jpg
E: Alex must play his harp, or Luna's blasts will kill him on the way up.
J: Alex does not have to play the harp to save Luna.

What about the damage she does? Does playing the harp reduce the damage taken, or is it low to begin with?

2) TSS_E_013.jpg TSS_J_030.jpg TSS_J_031.jpg
E: Quark mentions that he feels his and Luna's souls are intertwined.
J: Quark doesn't mention anything specific about Luna. "I noticed you before, the girl over there. Perhaps... ...no, it's nothing. I was just surprised that a young girl came to this kind of a place."

I’d phrase this more like “Quark notes Luna, but downplays it.” I think I like the J version better.

2) TSS_E_061.jpg TSS_J_121.jpg
E: The first Dragonmaster used Dragon Magic to transform Lunar
J: Nothing was specifically mentioned about Dragon Magic being used by the Dragonmaster to transform Lunar (note: other editions of Lunar clarified that Althena was the one who, with the help of the first Dragonmaster and the Four Dragons, transformed Lunar into a life-harboring place). "But, this world was transformed into a land of green through the first Dragonmaster, spoken of in legends."

The prologue to EB says that she “transformed it into a place of beauty and wonder. ... Time and circumstance soon forced Althena to populate Lunar with people from the Blue Star.” This doesn’t quite contradict that, but it may as well.

2) TSS_E_149.jpg TSS_E_150.jpg TSS_E_151.jpg TSS_E_152.jpg TSS_E_153.jpg TSS_E_154.jpg TSS_E_155.jpg TSS_E_156.jpg TSS_J_209.jpg TSS_J_210.jpg TSS_J_211.jpg TSS_J_212.jpg TSS_J_213.jpg
E: Ghaleon's diary entry is dated "12 Altar '34"
J: Ghaleon's diary entry has no date.

That’s perhaps significant, as I think G1’s timeline uses that as the only date that appears anywhere in the games. :P

2) TSS_E_194.jpg TSS_E_195.jpg TSS_J_248.jpg TSS_J_249.jpg
E: Book in Damon's spire prophecizes a green-eyed Dragonmaster
J: Book in Damon's spire is more cryptic. "All the world's fate began with Dragonmaster Dyne... But, all the world's fate will be let go and ended by Dragonmaster Dyne."

Wait, what? Dragonmaster Dyne specifically? Just “Dragonmaster” would make a lot more sense. Does the elder in Lyton (I think?) also mention the green eyes of the prophecy? That always bothered me, though I suppose Alex’s eyes are distinctive, much as Nash's hair is.

2) TSS_E_197.jpg TSS_E_198.jpg TSS_J_250.jpg TSS_J_251.jpg
E: Book in Damon's spire claims there can only be one Dragonmaster at a time.
J: No claim to there being only one Dragonmaster at a time. "The appearance of a Dragonmaster is an unlimited ray of hope. A Dragonmaster fights with the unbelievable strength of two shadows [literal]."

This sounds like a mistake, and of course doesn’t match later games with their mention of Alicia and Laticia, as well as Genesis. I’d consider it important except that I don’t think there’s been much talk about that particular like of TSS in discussions/arguments.

2) TSS_E_200.jpg TSS_E_201.jpg TSS_J_252.jpg TSS_J_253.jpg
E: Book in Damon's spire mentions the world losing power when the last of the Dragon Tribe dies.
J: Book in Damon's spire mentions the world losing a symbol of magic with the death of Quark/Fidy in particular, who was the last of the Dragons. "When the last dragon Quark dies and the world loses a symbol of magic power... the path to be a Dragonmaster is closed, and the Goddess is wrapped in darkness."

Hm, the E version says the world will grow dark, while the J one says the Goddess is wrapped in darkness. But I assume the overworld does darken in the J version too? Interesting that the book knows that the other three dragons are no more, too; weren’t the demises of the Blue and Red dragons pretty soon before Alex gets to them?

2) TSS_E_214.jpg TSS_E_215.jpg TSS_J_260.jpg TSS_J_261.jpg
E: Book in Damon's spire talks about prophecy from the Blue Star.
J: Book in Damon's spire talks about the Blue Star itself. "The legendary Blue Star shining in the heavens. Before long, it will bring about humanity's hope and salvation."

That’s interesting, considering that it was actually Lunar that was humanity’s hope after the Blue Star became uninhabitable. But is there any mention at all in this game that humans came from the Blue Star originally? And the “before long” sure doesn’t fit with the rest of the series.

2) TSS_J_262.jpg TSS_J_263.jpg
E: No explicit mention of Luna being, or not being, the Goddess until the Frontier.
J: Book in Damon's spire mentions Luna being a human. "The girl Luna, born in Burg, is not the Goddess Althena. The existence of the name of Luna is most certainly human."

I’d take this as an attempt to throw off the player, and perhaps establish that Damon isn’t all-knowing. I think it was probably a good call to remove that text in localization, though. What was the book in the E version?

2) TSS_E_408.jpg TSS_E_409.jpg TSS_J_492.jpg TSS_J_493.jpg
E: A person in Marke seems to know Nall by name.
J: No one in Marke knows Nall by name. Rather, someone recognizes the wings, perhaps as those of a white dragon. "Whoa!? That white animal with the wings... Oh no, my mistake. I haven't seen that for some tens of years now..."

This is interesting. Could it be around here that Nall was “born”? That would almost make sense (for the first time), that he and Quark both exist, because it was around there that the Black Dragon was confined and presumably died, and of course Dyne is the one who brought Nall to Alex’s parents. Maybe Nall was supposed to be a replacement for Black and something went wrong. :P (Hence why there was still enough spirit to animate the skeleton, which was supposed to have gone into creating a new dragon... blahblahblah. Getting distracted by general speculation.)

2) TSS_E_412.jpg TSS_J_495.jpg
E: Claim that half-beast half-humans don't have same emotions.
J: No claim that emotions are different across races. "I may be a beastman, but your words still move my heart... I wonder why is that?"

Yeah, sounds like a mistake. The beastman’s words reflect the separation of the two races/cultures, and actually works better with the Genesis setting as a backstory.

2) TSS_E_475.jpg TSS_E_476.jpg TSS_E_477.jpg TSS_J_599.jpg TSS_J_600.jpg
E: Ghaleon captured the pixies because he likes them, allegedly.
J: Ghaleon helped the pixies, allegedly, because they were about to die out in the Frontier. "We pixies who lived in the Frontier were about to die out. But, Master Ghaleon helped us."

This explains why they’re so positive toward him in EB. Though one wonders where they were in the intervening centuries. This also goes with the scene in LL when Ghaleon frees one from a trapper.

2) TSS_E_488.jpg TSS_E_489.jpg
E: The Dragon Angels refer to themselves as 'gods of compassion'.
J: The Dragon Angels don't refer to themselves as anything specific. "If this continues, then all magic power will be lost. The world will return to a world of death, and be destroyed... Stopping this is already beyond even the power of a Dragonmaster..."

I wonder why the ‘gods of compassion’ bit is there, then. And, of course, their prediction was illustrated in SSS with the Fortress.

3) TSS_E_018.jpg TSS_J_040.jpg
E: Laike says, when he meets you, "You kids must be the ones from Burg!"
J: Laike is less specific. "Oh... You all are people from the village of Burg..."

To respond to Darrell, this doesn’t seem pointless to me. It downplays Laike, making it more plausible that he encounters some locals in the course of his travels. The E phrasing suggests that he’s heard they’ve departed Burg, which they barely have.

3) TSS_E_066.jpg TSS_J_125.jpg TSS_J_126.jpg
E: The founders of Vane are said to be long dead
J: The people who know how Vane floats are no longer around. "Those who understand how Vane floats in the heavens are no longer. Only the sparkle of them remains."

Actually, this fits well with the Vheen manga, in which Latona says it was once their city. Of course, since Funato was a fan before she was “official”, that idea could be based on this specific line from TSS. “the sparkle of them”?

3) TSS_E_071.jpg TSS_J_131.jpg
E: Althena is immortal and lives in the Goddess Tower
J: Althena continues her rebirths, thereby remaining young, and lives in the Goddess Tower. "The Goddess Althena resides in the Goddess Tower at the heart of the world, continuing her rebirths, and always just as beautiful."

Wait, is that really the same as “remaining young”? The backstory Shiva Indis summarized from the TSS guides was that the crisis the Four Heroes dealt with was in part that Althena’s previous incarnation had grown old and weak. Also, this phrasing suggests that she reincarnates to live in the tower, whereas somewhere in TSS she’s said to take other forms on Lunar in her incarnation, “and has even lived here as a human!” It wouldn’t make sense for her to reincarnate only to stay put.

3) TSS_E_078.jpg TSS_J_137.jpg
E: No one knows where are the ruins of the Magic Empire (the empire which, a long time ago, tried to revolt against Althena)
J: No one knows anymore where the Magic Empire was. "There is no longer anyone who knows where the Magic Empire was."

TSS does seem rather light on ruins for an RPG, doesn’t it? I agree with Darrell that the E sentence suggests an upcoming dungeon, which never materializes. The implication of the J sentence to me is that it was in the Frontier, since that’s the big unknown area.

3) TSS_E_079.jpg TSS_J_138.jpg
E: Vane floated into the sky as a result of the Goddess' Tears
J: Vane floated into the sky when the Goddess' Tears flowed. "When the Goddess' Tears which covered the world flowed, Vane floated into the sky."

Was going to make the same comment to Darrell that you did, so I won't bother now. In the Encyclopedia I'd cross-reference this to Serak Palace and Althena's Tears therein, though. ^^

3) TSS_E_088.jpg TSS_J_159.jpg
E: Vane's activities are controlled from the Star Chamber
J: Vane's magic power is controlled from the Star Chamber. "This Star Chamber is the place where Vane's magic power is controlled..."

This makes sense, as the location for whatever super-secret ritual that "Lemia" was going to conduct with Ghaleon, and also that entering it while something was going on was forbidden, as it could be dangerous and/or the place of a potential coup. We're never told why Ghaleon and Xenobia were up there, but doing something with the magic of Vane related to Ghaleon's takeover would make a lot more sense than something governmental, which is what it sounded more like in TSS. (As a side thought, it kind of fits with SSS's added use of the Silver Spire as the seat of Vane's defenses... except that's the wrong tower.) This also makes sense of something that's always bothered me, that the Grindery shoots more or les over the bulk of Vane; the Star Chamber could be where the magic that kept it in the sky was controlled.

3) TSS_E_337.jpg TSS_E_338.jpg TSS_J_408.jpg TSS_J_409.jpg
E: Althena provided a seal to the cave to seal the fiend in.
J: Althena provided a mysterious stone, which was the seal that kept the fiend in the cave. "Long ago, a demon which spread disease was sealed in a cave by the Goddess Althena's power. The thing that sealed the demon is a mysterious stone that is called the Goddess's Seal."

This makes sense since the Goddess Seal is an item you take back to the Pao elder, unlike the seals on doors in EB. It always sounded wrong to me since I visualized something more like an engraving on a wall. Also, I don't remember -- in the E version did the fiend also bring disease? I don't remember that being specified, and it seemed strange to me that this seal on a monster would be used to cure the illness -- but if the purpose of it was to combat a plague-spreading monster, it makes sense. (Also goes with my feeling that Althena is a goddess of healing primarily, but that's not really part of this.)

4) TSS_J_053.jpg
E: Gambler's name is Brett
J: Gambler's name is Krysa [kuraisa]

Any other name changes you noticed, besides the ones in the artbook? I really want to know about these. I'll have to add this to my spreadsheet. I suppose that's probably a silly question given that you address a bunch of other names, though. :P

4) TSS_J_054.jpg
E: Nash is a Level 3 apprentice
J: Nash is a third-year student in the Magic Guild of Vane

I thought he was called a third-year student somewhere too.. maybe in one of the remakes.

4) TSS_E_289.jpg TSS_E_290.jpg TSS_J_344.jpg
E: Prarie tribe names: Fresca (Franchesca) and her husband Tempest.
J: Prarie tribe names: Pilya and Temujin

First, you'll want to correct your typo to Prairie. :P Vic told me that he put in the "it's short for Franchesca" to disguise her name's soda-can origin. And, of course, you know that Tempest is called Temzin in the artbook, and Shiva Indis (I think) mentioned that Temujin is what the Japanese call Genghis Khan, which certainly goes with the nomad setting of Pao.

4) TSS_E_331.jpg TSS_E_332.jpg TSS_J_401.jpg TSS_J_402.jpg
E: A fiend named Grissel came here 5000 years ago.
J: A fiend, unnamed, came here 5000 years ago. "5000 years ago... an ancient demon came to the Plains and spread disease. This plague is the curse of that demon..."

4) TSS_E_348.jpg TSS_J_415.jpg
E: The cave is called Grimzol's Cave.
J: The cave is called the Demon's Cave.

4) TSS_E_350.jpg TSS_J_416.jpg
E: The boss in Grimzol's Cave is called the 'Inca God' by Nall.
J: The boss in the Demon's Cave is called Karal [kararu] by Nall.

4) TSS_E_351.jpg TSS_J_417.jpg
E: Tempest calls the boss in Grimzol's Cave Grimzol.
J: Tempest calls the boss in the Demon's Cave a demon.

This is interesting. I always thought that Grissel and Grimzol were just inconsistent translations of whatever the Japanese name is, but it's not even clear that they refer to the same creature. Though I suppose they probably were both versions of Karal, given the similarity of consonants.

4) TSS_E_484.jpg TSS_J_617.jpg
E: The two creatures who gave Alex the sword are the Dragon Angels.
J: The two creatures who gave Alex the sword are called just Angels.

Again, I like the E version better. I imagine the change was because you fight them, as you did the Black Dragon, so it's the last trial before becoming a Dragonmaster.

5) TSS_J_001.jpg
E: No title screen with text
J: Splash screen with odd intro text

What's the "odd intro text" say?

5) TSS_J_629.jpg TSS_J_630.jpg
E: Double-meaning of words couldn't be translated.
J: Double-meaning of the word 'koto': refers to Alex's harp, and Alex himself. So, Luna/Althena is able to imply both Alex's harp and the personage of Alex. "...!? Harp [koto]...? A harp's sound? I can hear it... Alex!? ... Alex? I feel you... Alex's being [koto]... Ah, Alex..."

I'd call this important. It also makes sense that the harp sounds and all were part of the Japanese scene even though it wasn't necessary to play the harp.

6) TSS_E_055.jpg TSS_E_057.jpg TSS_E_058.jpg TSS_J_101.jpg TSS_J_102.jpg
E: The Vile Tribe roamed about 500 years ago, but Althena banished them to the Frontier.
J: The Vile Tribe roamed about 500 years ago, but Althena sealed them in the Frontier. "500 years ago, the Vile Tribe, who tormented people, lived in this world. But, the Goddess Althena, for the sake of the people, banished the Vile Tribe to the Frontier and sealed them there."

Is the transmission spring having been defunct for 10 years also mentioned? Wondering because clearly the seal on the Vile Tribe isn't the same thing keeping the people there, because, besides Xenobia, several henchmen show up in Burg.

6) TSS_E_110.jpg TSS_J_174.jpg
E: Jessica's full name is Jessica Alkirk.
J: Jessica's full name is Jessica Alkirk.

I still wonder about this. Why would only Mel have the "de"?

Although you said it's safe to assume that if you haven't mentioned it here it's equivalent between the games, I thought of a few things I wondered about while reading this list:

- Does Mia call out for "Papa" when she's sick, as she does in English?
- Does the woman in Nanza who says Alex is too young to know about what she's selling have about the same lines?
- Does the Wheaties kid say anything different instead of mentioning he's eating his Wheaties, or just that he wants to be an adventurer (or whatever it is)?
- Is Dross's name the same? Lily's? Heck, just fill in my character spreadsheet, would you? ^^

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Postby Kizyr » Sun Sep 30, 2007 12:06 am

This is good to know, because it didn’t make sense with his wife being a noblewoman of the city and his having been a pirate when he fought Dyne. (Though now I forget if all of that is in the original.)


Oh yeah, that's in the original. Same story in both languages.

Is there a reference to Meryod having burned down in the Japanese EB?


Nope, none at all.

This change was made at Sega’s behest, which is why they’re pentagrams in the US remakes.


Ah, good to know.

What about the damage she does? Does playing the harp reduce the damage taken, or is it low to begin with?


I'd have to double-check, but I don't think the harp has any effect at all.

Wait, what? Dragonmaster Dyne specifically? Just “Dragonmaster” would make a lot more sense. Does the elder in Lyton (I think?) also mention the green eyes of the prophecy? That always bothered me, though I suppose Alex’s eyes are distinctive, much as Nash's hair is.


Dyne specifically, yes. There is mention of Alex's green eyes, though.

That’s interesting, considering that it was actually Lunar that was humanity’s hope after the Blue Star became uninhabitable. But is there any mention at all in this game that humans came from the Blue Star originally? And the “before long” sure doesn’t fit with the rest of the series.


I can't remember specifically, but there might still be some mention of the Blue Star being the original home. I wouldn't put too much importance on the 'before long' words, though, since it's ambiguous.

I’d take this as an attempt to throw off the player, and perhaps establish that Damon isn’t all-knowing. I think it was probably a good call to remove that text in localization, though. What was the book in the E version?


I don't have a screenshot for that (I may need to go back later for supplemental shots).

Actually, this fits well with the Vheen manga, in which Latona says it was once their city. Of course, since Funato was a fan before she was “official”, that idea could be based on this specific line from TSS. “the sparkle of them”?


If I were translating this for real, instead of trying to give about the same words as in Japanese, I would've changed that particular line. "the sparkle of them" is more literal, but refers to the highlights of the things that they would've left behind--concrete and intangible.

3) TSS_E_071.jpg TSS_J_131.jpg
E: Althena is immortal and lives in the Goddess Tower
J: Althena continues her rebirths, thereby remaining young, and lives in the Goddess Tower. "The Goddess Althena resides in the Goddess Tower at the heart of the world, continuing her rebirths, and always just as beautiful."

Wait, is that really the same as “remaining young”? The backstory Shiva Indis summarized from the TSS guides was that the crisis the Four Heroes dealt with was in part that Althena’s previous incarnation had grown old and weak. Also, this phrasing suggests that she reincarnates to live in the tower, whereas somewhere in TSS she’s said to take other forms on Lunar in her incarnation, “and has even lived here as a human!” It wouldn’t make sense for her to reincarnate only to stay put.


She doesn't get reborn in order to live in the Goddess Tower; it's not really specific there. I may need to go back and read the TSS manual now, though, if that story's really in there.

Also, I don't remember -- in the E version did the fiend also bring disease? I don't remember that being specified, and it seemed strange to me that this seal on a monster would be used to cure the illness -- but if the purpose of it was to combat a plague-spreading monster, it makes sense. (Also goes with my feeling that Althena is a goddess of healing primarily, but that's not really part of this.)


Yeah, Grimzol brought disease in the English version too.

I thought he was called a third-year student somewhere too.. maybe in one of the remakes.


I still need a corresponding English screenshot of this one, too.

First, you'll want to correct your typo to Prairie. :P Vic told me that he put in the "it's short for Franchesca" to disguise her name's soda-can origin. And, of course, you know that Tempest is called Temzin in the artbook, and Shiva Indis (I think) mentioned that Temujin is what the Japanese call Genghis Khan, which certainly goes with the nomad setting of Pao.


Temujin is what everyone calls Genghis Khan--Genghis Khan was his title; Temujin was his given name.

Anyway, this was one of the reasons I preferred the Praiiiiiirie Tribe's setup in TSS over SSS. The TSS Prairie Tribe was modeled after Mongolian nomads, while the SSS ones were modeled after American Midwest Plains Indians.

What's the "odd intro text" say?


That's in the associated screenshot. Something about man and beast serving Althena together.

Is the transmission spring having been defunct for 10 years also mentioned? Wondering because clearly the seal on the Vile Tribe isn't the same thing keeping the people there, because, besides Xenobia, several henchmen show up in Burg.


Yeah, same thing is in the English version.

- Does Mia call out for "Papa" when she's sick, as she does in English?


No; I can add this part perhaps. It didn't seem significant ebough to include at first.

- Does the woman in Nanza who says Alex is too young to know about what she's selling have about the same lines?


As far as I recall, yeah.

- Does the Wheaties kid say anything different instead of mentioning he's eating his Wheaties, or just that he wants to be an adventurer (or whatever it is)?


I don't quite recall. Probably what you said there, though. I didn't spend a lot of time on tracing the pop-culture references.

- Is Dross's name the same? Lily's? Heck, just fill in my character spreadsheet, would you? ^^


Dross is about the same. Lily's name, I think, is closer to 'Lila'. KF

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Postby Alunissage » Sun Sep 30, 2007 12:33 am

Mia's calling out for Papa was interesting to me because it's the only mention in any of the games of an Ausa having a male relative. Of course, the Vheen manga shows a father or two in those pages of generations, but that's it.

Oh, and I'm pretty sure Shiva Indis said she got the backstory from the guides, not the manual. But checking my notes I see it was in a PM to me and I don't remember if she ever posted it on the boards. "My post about Mel was a summary from the translations I've been doing from the 2nd LTSS guide. Basically, I've translated the very front and the very back, and I'll give you a rundown of the things that stood out. ... I think there was some talk of this in LTSS, but the Four Heroes fought a sorceror who summoned a powerful devil in order to... defeat(? Destroy? A frustratingly vague verb here,) Althena. Althena's power had weakened at that time because her incarnation had grown old. No one knows why this happened, and few outside of the Four Heroes know about it at all."

In a rather funny coincidence, I just today started packing a bunch of Lunar things to send to G1, including both TSS guides... which I bought for him before either of us remembered that he already has one. If the one he has is this second volume (138, the purple one), and you don't have it, I could send it to you instead, although I'd better yank that Mia's Bromide 4 phonecard out of it first. :P

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Postby Kizyr » Sun Sep 30, 2007 2:01 am

Alunissage wrote:Oh, and I'm pretty sure Shiva Indis said she got the backstory from the guides, not the manual. But checking my notes I see it was in a PM to me and I don't remember if she ever posted it on the boards. "My post about Mel was a summary from the translations I've been doing from the 2nd LTSS guide. Basically, I've translated the very front and the very back, and I'll give you a rundown of the things that stood out. ... I think there was some talk of this in LTSS, but the Four Heroes fought a sorceror who summoned a powerful devil in order to... defeat(? Destroy? A frustratingly vague verb here,) Althena. Althena's power had weakened at that time because her incarnation had grown old. No one knows why this happened, and few outside of the Four Heroes know about it at all."


Oh? That's the same backstory that was explained by one guy in class in Vane--English and Japanese versions.

In a rather funny coincidence, I just today started packing a bunch of Lunar things to send to G1, including both TSS guides... which I bought for him before either of us remembered that he already has one. If the one he has is this second volume (138, the purple one), and you don't have it, I could send it to you instead, although I'd better yank that Mia's Bromide 4 phonecard out of it first. :P


Well... I don't have any TSS guides, so if you really don't mind sending me one, I'd definitely appreciate it. Let me know if you'd like anything in return, or if you need me to pay for anything (cost and/or shipping). KF

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Postby ilovemyguitar » Sun Sep 30, 2007 9:33 pm

2) TSS_J_262.jpg TSS_J_263.jpg
E: No explicit mention of Luna being, or not being, the Goddess until the Frontier.
J: Book in Damon's spire mentions Luna being a human. "The girl Luna, born in Burg, is not the Goddess Althena. The existence of the name of Luna is most certainly human."


I’d take this as an attempt to throw off the player, and perhaps establish that Damon isn’t all-knowing. I think it was probably a good call to remove that text in localization, though. What was the book in the E version?


It's obviously there to throw the player off, but I don't think it necessarily means Damon isn't all-knowing. Rather, I think this line establishes that Luna is a 100% human incarnation, and that under the guise of Luna she doesn't have access to Althena's Goddess powers (i.e., Luna wouldn't be able to terraform Lunar again if she wanted to), and that neither have access to the others' memories.
Image

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Postby Kizyr » Sun Sep 30, 2007 10:17 pm

Ok I updated a few of the items here mentioned, and added the following:

2) TSS_E_356.gif TSS_E_357.gif TSS_J_426.gif TSS_J_427.gif
E: Mia calls out for 'Papa' once when she's sick in Pao.
J: Mia only calls out for her mother again when she's sick. "Help me... Mother... I'm in such pain... Oh I'm no longer in pain... I'm better now, thanks to all of you."

I think it's good to go right now. I'm going to move on to the remakes now. Unfortunately, I didn't take screenshots (since I was playing them on the actual system, not the emulator), so it's going to be all-text. KF

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Postby scaryice » Mon Oct 08, 2007 11:31 am

Awesome job on this, keep it up.

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Fulari

Postby Temzin » Fri Nov 02, 2007 1:49 am

Re: Ramus "leaving town with someone named Fulari." This is a tiny point, but the "fulari" is actually WD's mistranslation of the sound effect furari, indicating pointlessly or suddendly (leaving). So it's not フラリ(という人)と村を飛び出した, but rather, フラリと(当てもなく)村を飛び出した.
Last edited by Temzin on Fri Nov 02, 2007 7:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Fulari

Postby Kizyr » Fri Nov 02, 2007 2:08 am

Temzin wrote:Re: Ramus "leaving town with someone named Fulari." This is a tiny point, but the "fulari" is actually WD's mistranslation of the sound effect furari, indicating pointlessly or suddendly (leaving). So it's not フラリ(という人)と村うを飛び出した, but rather, フラリと(当てもなく)村を飛び出した.

I totally did not know that. Now that I'm reading the dialogue again, it doesn't sound like a person's name.

I'll update that tonight. Thanks!

EDIT: I gave you mention by name in the beginning of the TSS Differences page now. Hope you don't mind. KF

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Postby Alunissage » Fri Nov 02, 2007 5:16 am

That makes so much more sense. Another thing to mess up my character list, along with Kakar in EBC. :P

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Re: Fulari

Postby Temzin » Fri Nov 02, 2007 7:03 pm

Hey Kiz, thanks for the shout-out! I haven't really done much for Lunar-Net and by extension for my much-beloved game series since the whole Lunar 1&2 Design Materials translation (did people ever read that? Never got much feedback) so it's nice to be able to help again even if it's the tiniest thing compared with your amazing project.

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Postby Alunissage » Tue Nov 13, 2007 10:53 pm

I was looking at the TSS guide again yesterday and noted that the monster stat section said that WD beefed up the stats of a few monsters that weren't deemed tough enough in the original. So I compared the stats in the US guide to those in the Japanese guide (imagine how fun that wasn't :P) and found that indeed a number of stats, both regular and bosses, were inconsistent between the two guides. However, they weren't always made tougher. Also, some differences were so great as to make me think that they're probably typos, like having 0 MP vs 300. It'll be difficult checking most of these, but here are a few of the most plausible:

Inca God: 2340 HP in E, 1800 HP in J
Black Dragon: 4900 in E, 3500 HP in J
Xenobia: 4185 HP in E, 3100 HP in J

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Postby GhaleonOne » Tue Nov 13, 2007 11:14 pm

Hey Kiz, thanks for the shout-out! I haven't really done much for Lunar-Net and by extension for my much-beloved game series since the whole Lunar 1&2 Design Materials translation (did people ever read that? Never got much feedback) so it's nice to be able to help again even if it's the tiniest thing compared with your amazing project.


Are you kidding? The materials you translated were awesome! I know a lot of people enjoyed reading through it, myself included!
-G1

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Postby Alunissage » Wed Nov 14, 2007 3:13 am

Yes, those materials were really, really useful and great to have in general. I've been wondering what they said ever since I got that artbook. Let us know if you feel like doing more. ;)

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Postby Temzin » Sat Nov 17, 2007 11:42 pm

Ah, good, I'm glad! Alun, those stat changes are great, too! I'm glad they beefed up some of those in the US one...even if the post-Red Dragon Cave half of that game still strikes me as much much too easy compared to the brutal beginning. Maybe it's because I played EB first and thus was trained never to run from a fight (and this is without ever stopping to level up). Too bad Ghaleon was left unchanged!


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